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I got stuck up at gupoint (not sure if the gun was real) in Boca. Got my bag, $, camera, and most inconvenietly, my LP Argentina book. They are not for sale at all here.
Anyone in BA that can give me a look at their LP book would be doing me a great favor. Shoot me back a private message or call me at my Hotel Dos Congresos at 4372 0466 room 109 anytime, email me at heevay at yahoo dot com, or give me a way to contact you.
I promise you true tales and free beer
[QUOTE=Skip1]I got stuck up at gupoint (not sure if the gun was real) in Boca. Got my bag, $, camera, and most inconvenietly, my LP Argentina book. They are not for sale at all here.
Anyone in BA that can give me a look at their LP book would be doing me a great favor. Shoot me back a private message or call me at my Hotel Dos Congresos at 4372 0466 room 109 anytime, email me at heevay at yahoo dot com, or give me a way to contact you.
I promise you true tales and free beer[/QUOTE]Sorry to hear about your ordeal. If you can post a bit more about how / when this happened, perhaps others can learn from it and avoid it!
More on the great stickup. I went to Boca and wandered around the tourist-tango area near the river and then walked along the river to the right as you face the river for about 1km were the old derelict boats are with no problem at all. The next day I came back and did the tango area again, had some pizza in a very local place just outside the tango area bought some bootleg CD's from a very nice guy at a stand and walked along the river to the left as you face the river – also no prob.
BUT after about 300 meters to the left at the old disused big rusty steel bridge structure that is in all the tourist pictures, there are little boats that run across to the other side of the river. It is a very short distance – less than 100 meters to the other side. The boats are rowboats and very picturesque and well maintained. They look very atractive and legitimate. BE WARNED on the other side of the river, were they go, is one of the most dangerous places in BA – maybe in all of Argentina. It's called ISLA MARCEL. I was suck up at gunpoint almost immediately as I got off the boat – within 30 meters.
When I told my Argentine friends about it they thought it was almost funny that I managed to find the worst are in BA by accident - a place "where no tourists go and no Argentines go". This is a really lawless area that even the cops keep away from.
The thing about it is that the boats look so innocent – as if they were designed to look cute for tourists. At a minimum, those boats should be barred from taking ANY foreigners and warning signs should be posted. This is a major danger.
From what I remember, most of Boca is a dodgy area. I explored it and the surrounding area once when I just moved here.
Can you think of anything that may have set you off as a "mark" for these guys?
I'm not saying this necessarily applies to you, but its fairly common to see foreigners walking around relatively poor areas with "Please Jack Me" plastered all over them. Cameras around neck, clueless looking, Indiana Jones hats, audible English / French / German, visible "waistpacks" undoubtedly stuffed with cash, etc.
[QUOTE=Skip1]More on the great stickup. I went to Boca and wandered around the tourist-tango area near the river and then walked along the river to the right as you face the river for about 1km were the old derelict boats are with no problem at all. The next day I came back and did the tango area again, had some pizza in a very local place just outside the tango area bought some bootleg CD's from a very nice guy at a stand and walked along the river to the left as you face the river – also no prob.
BUT after about 300 meters to the left at the old disused big rusty steel bridge structure that is in all the tourist pictures, there are little boats that run across to the other side of the river. It is a very short distance – less than 100 meters to the other side. The boats are rowboats and very picturesque and well maintained. They look very atractive and legitimate. BE WARNED on the other side of the river, were they go, is one of the most dangerous places in BA – maybe in all of Argentina. It's called ISLA MARCEL. I was suck up at gunpoint almost immediately as I got off the boat – within 30 meters.
When I told my Argentine friends about it they thought it was almost funny that I managed to find the worst are in BA by accident - a place "where no tourists go and no Argentines go". This is a really lawless area that even the cops keep away from.
The thing about it is that the boats look so innocent – as if they were designed to look cute for tourists. At a minimum, those boats should be barred from taking ANY foreigners and warning signs should be posted. This is a major danger.[/QUOTE]It is called "Isla Maciel" and it is certainly very dangerous.
Andres
Not in your category, but had my rented cellphone swiped off my belt by a swift moving, bicycling ladron tonight. Just less than a block away from Exedra, walking with Emilia, a sweet little mexicana to catch a cab back to my place. I heard snatch and grab was the main MO down here. Didn't take me long to see it in action.
The dog
Yeah I was taking pics of the steel bridge with a small digital camera and was, I supose, clearly a foreginer. My point is that the area and partularly the boats did not look dangerous. I've travelled to all kinds of places and you have to make judgment calls all the time an this one looked ok. That's why a warning is needed at that particlar spot.
An argentine friend of mine, middle class guy in his 30's, told me that Isla Maciel used to be an ok old neiborhood 20 years ago - his grandparents lived there but it turned bad as the the old timers moved out.
More info re: my stolen cellphone. I got a new phone today from Phonerental, the company I opted to deal with on a short term basis here. Bad news-in the fine print I am responsible for half of replacement costs (plus taxes) on the stolen phone. I ain't shaming myself with the exact figure out of my pocket, but it was substantial. Don't let your phone get stolen!
Cheap cell phones here go for 100 pesos. Check Clarin and La Nacion for daily sales and see if they over charged you for the same model.
Will do, thanks for the info.
[QUOTE=Skip1]An argentine friend of mine, middle class guy in his 30's, told me that Isla Maciel used to be an ok old neiborhood 20 years ago - his grandparents lived there but it turned bad as the the old timers moved out.[/QUOTE]Skip1:
Isla Maciel was always dangerous, although not as extreme as nowadays. In fact, some minor companies operate there, and the Club Atletico San Telmo has its stadium in the heart of the island. Thus, some people should be able to go to work or watch a game without much hassle.
Hope this helps,
Andres
I hate to revive an old threat, but my experience today warrants it.
I was having lunch alone at La Strada near V. Lopez and Junin today around 2:30. About twenty minutes after sitting down, some men rode up to the entrance on a motorcycle and one jumped off and ran into the restaurant. I only saw him in my peripheral vision for a split second before he hit me very hard in the face. He then began pulling at my watch, which was pretty nice, and I stood up and swung back. At that point, his friend donkey punched me in the back of the head and I sort of grayed out for a minute. When I regained my senses, they had taken off on the bike.
I have a fractured orbit and quite a lot of soreness, but am otherwise okay. The police believe that I was followed for some time prior to the attack, since my table could not be seen from the sidewalk, and that I was very lucky. They said that these attacks are usually conducted with either a gun or knife involved.
I've no idea how they zeroed in on me, other than the fact that I am dressed nicely, but I have taken normal precautions on this trip (radio taxis, not pulling out maps in public, etc. Anyway, be safe out there!
If you see me out and about, say hi. I am the mellow American with a big shiner.
What kind of watch? Did they take your wallet, too?
That area is usually patrolled, isn't it?
Sssshhhhh! There's no crime in BA!;)
PM out, Moore.
Edited to add: The restaurant refused to call the police, which I thought was odd, but they did call an ambulance. The hospital called the police after I arrived and they came to the ER to take my report.
And no, they did not even reach for my cell phone or bag. It was very, very fast and almost surgical.
What did they look like? Age, clothes, race, size?
[QUOTE=Breakawaytx]PM out, Moore.
Edited to add: The restaurant refused to call the police, which I thought was odd, but they did call an ambulance. The hospital called the police after I arrived and they came to the ER to take my report.
And no, they did not even reach for my cell phone or bag. It was very, very fast and almost surgical.[/QUOTE]The restaurant doesn't want the bad pub. Good luck to you. As an aside, there is clearly an increase in crime in the tonier areas of Capital Federal. Not that my castellano is worth a damn, but if you only read the BA Herald you won't get the info about increasing street crime in Palermo, and as noted here by Breakawaytx, in Recoleta. I am definitely not an alarmist, but the advise about dressing down and leaving the Rolex at home is advice well taken.
Normal precautions would include not wearing a fancy watch, I would think. I'm sorry you had that experience. I wonder if those were the same "world's best thieves" that robbed Saint. The locations are very similar.
I fail to see how you were lucky. I also wonder if your Black chica set you up. She was in your pad, she saw your watch, she told some of her friends to watch your place, etc.
Moral of the story: Be like me. Dress like shit.
I am staying just around the corner from where you were attacked today. I was in session at 2pm with a favorita or I might have been on your sidewalk or possibly even in that cafe at that time. I normally eat lunch around 2 - 2:30pm. I like to stay close to my apartment so I usually dine at one of the restaurants near Vicente Lopez next to the Recoletta Hotel! I'm sorry this happened to you and I'm even sorrier about the response by the police.
Coach
[QUOTE=Moore]What did they look like? Age, clothes, race, size?[/QUOTE]I couldn't really say much, aside from stocky, middle-aged men, since I didn't see the first punch coming. Definitely not kids, though.
As an aside, every single porteno guest at that restaurant came over to offer assistance and their personal apologies for what happened. They were clearly mortified. I still love this country and its fine people.
Hey does anyone know what the law in BA is regarding carrying mace or a stun gun. I usually dress casual, but I sometimes wear nice watches and sometimes dress nice. I am just wondering because I don't mind getting into a good ol' scrap but if there are usually multiple attackers or they have a weapon, a nice stun gun or mace might do some good.
Badboy
[QUOTE=Badboy13]Hey does anyone know what the law in BA is regarding carrying mace or a stun gun. I usually dress casual, but I sometimes wear nice watches and sometimes dress nice. I am just wondering because I don't mind getting into a good ol' scrap but if there are usually multiple attackers or they have a weapon, a nice stun gun or mace might do some good.
Badboy[/QUOTE]I don't know the laws here, but consider this:
A stun gun is a contact weapon - meaning that you have to be within arm's reach to employ it. So, if your attacker is armed, you will probably get shot or stabbed. Plus, they are not consistent when layers of clothes are involved.
Mace is a straight up joke. I had a pissed off GF mace me once just for spite, and it did nothing more than make me really angry.
Unless they are unarmed, just give them what they want and live to tell the tale.
Lets see first this guy goes to Black, breaks every rule in the book, and then gets mugged inside a Recoleta restaurant. He has a grand total of four post, and two of those are follow ups. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!:rolleyes::confused:
[QUOTE=Breakawaytx]I don't know the laws here, but consider this:
A stun gun is a contact weapon - meaning that you have to be within arm's reach to employ it. So, if your attacker is armed, you will probably get shot or stabbed. Plus, they are not consistent when layers of clothes are involved.
Mace is a straight up joke. I had a pissed off GF mace me once just for spite, and it did nothing more than make me really angry.
Unless they are unarmed, just give them what they want and live to tell the tale.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the comments, though I would still like to know what the laws in BA are.
I have personally used stun guns and mace and they work extremely well. I don't really know what you are talking about. If you get mace directly in someones face, they can't see, some people get violent allergic reactions on contact, I have personaly seen some people almost die when taking a full shot in their mouth. I have taken a few shots myself at a few night clubs by some scurred bouncers in LA, and even though it didn't cause any real damage, it completely impaired my ability to fight, dude I couldn't see shit. And my dumb mother fucker friends poured bottled water on my face, which only made shit worse. So umm, if anyone is willing to test Breaks theory out just PM me, I have a face full of mace for you, lets see if it only makes you "angry". You need to know how to use it ofcourse, just like any weapon, but if used properly it can work.
Sorry but I love that stuff, and you are correct about stun guns being mainly used for close contact, but umm, they have many kinds of stun guns and some you can shoot at quite a nice distance. But one of my favorite techniques is pulling out the stun gun and instead of swinging back, I would much rather get a clear shot of the jugular or carotid.
I am not advocating anyone" fighting back " when getting robbed, I am mainly asking if anyone knows what the laws are in BA regarding such weapons for MY own personal safety. If someone doesn't think these things work thats fine with me, from my own personal experience, I think, when used properly, they work just fine.
Badboy
[QUOTE=Punter 127]Lets see first this guy goes to Black, breaks every rule in the book, and then gets mugged inside a Recoleta restaurant. He has a grand total of four post, and two of those are follow ups. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!:rolleyes::confused:[/QUOTE]If you have a problem with me or with my responding to questions, just say so. Not that I really care.
[QUOTE=Breakawaytx]PM out, Moore.
Edited to add: The restaurant refused to call the police, which I thought was odd, but they did call an ambulance. The hospital called the police after I arrived and they came to the ER to take my report.
.[/QUOTE]Maybe this is why the bald guy at El Yugo keeps the door locked?
I wouldn't doubt that when you paid the 300 usd for a chica in Black it caused a flag to go up ending with you being robbed. They probably figured if a guy can pay that for a chica he must have stuff worth stealing. When a chica demands 200p and I walk away with 150p being my starting and ending offer nobody suspects I am worth robbing.
Pepper spray ("Halt") is a good alternative to Mace and you can use it on dogs. It has the added advantage of containing a dye that marks the assailant.
Now I remember I was confusing Saint's "world's best thieves," who were not on a motorbike, with the guy who got his "Rolodex" stolen off his wrist in that neighborhood. [b]Those[/b] were the guys with the same M. O.
I'm not sure where I read about it, but one of the crime modes in BA is to spray an oil / mustard / spice / recipe on unsuspecting tourists. Someone comes by to offer "help" and uses the opportunity to grab wallets, purses, cameras, backpacks, etc.
Yesterday, I was walking down Libertador on my way to the Retiro Station. A middle-aged man pulled on my arm and pointed out a large blotches of muddy looking stuff on my pants. I immediately distanced myself from him and he jumped into a car that was conveniently parked on the curb nearby.
I told someone else about the incident and they immediately asked me if I was in Recoleta when it happened. When I said "yes" they said they had heard of a couple of other similar incidents in the past few weeks, but the others had been robbed because they did not realize what was going on.
Cuidado guys.
[QUOTE=Badboy13]Hey does anyone know what the law in BA is regarding carrying mace or a stun gun. I usually dress casual, but I sometimes wear nice watches and sometimes dress nice. I am just wondering because I don't mind getting into a good ol' scrap but if there are usually multiple attackers or they have a weapon, a nice stun gun or mace might do some good.
Badboy[/QUOTE]In Argentina you can do whatever you want.
I would worry more about stuff like metal detectors at boliches.
[QUOTE=Redondo]In Argentina you can do whatever you want.[/QUOTE]So you're telling us in Argentina we can carry any kind of weapon we want?
So I can carry my normal concealed carry weapon, just like at home, I find that hard to believe?
Carrying concealed weapons (slaps, brass knuckles, stun guns, mace, asps, etc) is illegal. I imagine a small pocket knife like a swiss army style with less than 3 blade would be okay but a 4" folding buck would draw scrutiny)
Carrying concealed firearms without a permit is illegal.
I spoke with some cops several years ago and they confirmed.
[QUOTE=Thomaso276]Carrying concealed weapons (slaps, brass knuckles, stun guns, mace, asps, etc) is illegal. I imagine a small pocket knife like a swiss army style with less than 3 blade would be okay but a 4" folding buck would draw scrutiny)
Carrying concealed firearms without a permit is illegal.
I spoke with some cops several years ago and they confirmed.[/QUOTE]Thanks that ’s the way I thought it was but I wasn ’t sure, so I didn ’t want to just say it (Redondo) was wrong.
Thomas 276 is absolutely correct and I disagree with carrying mace or stun guns. It's a sure way of getting yourself shot or badly hurt!
Having any sort of concealed weapon means having to be 100% alert at all times. The crooks always use the surprise factor and to try to go for your stunner or mace once you are in the middle of a robbery is the most sure way to get your face smashed in.
If for some reason you do happen to be carrying valuables, the best thing is to keep alert. Look around you, look at the people following you in the face and make sure they know you are looking at them. Do unexpected things like walk halfway down a block and turn on your heels and return.
Crooks usually work in quite large bands. If they have singled you out to be robbed, you will be followed by two or three different people till the place and moment is right then you get "hit".
Of course, if you are out for an evening with a chica such paranoid behaviour wouldn't be advisable. So just carry the minimum you really need for that evening.
[QUOTE=Thomaso276]Carrying concealed weapons (slaps, brass knuckles, stun guns, mace, asps, etc) is illegal. I imagine a small pocket knife like a swiss army style with less than 3 blade would be okay but a 4" folding buck would draw scrutiny)
Carrying concealed firearms without a permit is illegal. I spoke with some cops several years ago and they confirmed.[/QUOTE]Thomaso, I'm not sure you are correct regarding the illegality of carrying a stun gun. As I understand it, here in Argentina you are allowed to, if you care to, carry a stun gun. The internet site below states clearly that the use of a stun gun is legal in Argentina.
[url]http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-29798818-electroshock-200000-voltios-legal-y-no-letal-_JM[/url]
Thomaso, skip the ads for the stun guns and go directly to the section in which they discuss the legality of stun guns.
I thought about buying one when I first started jogging here in the city and started seeing packs of abandoned dogs. After a while I realized the dogs are fairly sweet. Just abandoned by assholes. The other time I thought of buying a stun gun is when I was jogging early one morning in Parque Tres de Febrero and two of Exon's girlfriends, travesties, started jogging next to me in 6 inch pumps, fishnet stockings, boas wrapped around their necks, and with their silicone boobs blowing in the early morning wind. I started laughing so hard at the sight of these two ridiculous travesties I almost fell down. They turned out to be just as harmless as the abandoned dogs.
Thomaso, I've been to quite a few rough areas of the city and so far I haven't had the need to carry a concealed weapon. However, I do, occasionally, think about carrying one.
[QUOTE=Punter 127]So you're telling us in Argentina we can carry any kind of weapon we want?
So I can carry my normal concealed carry weapon, just like at home, I find that hard to believe?[/QUOTE]I don't know if you legally carry a (stun) gun, but as laws are not enforced in Argentina so you probally can.
I don't know what the chances are of you getting searced in Argentina but I only get searced if I go to a boliche, airport, Buquebus or a soccer game.
I think if you avoid these places or leave your gun at home you will be fine.
But what the "end result" might be of carrying the weapons.
I think if a crook sees a weapon, there are two possible reactions;
- He will run away! (That is what you hope for)
- He might get a lot more violent, and try to get control over the weapon. (That is what the most likely reaction is) He might think / guess / hope that you do not want to use the weapon. (As written earlier by Aqualung.)
And if you use your weapon to wound / kill the attacker, what will be the legal consequence?
No, I think it is smarter to stay away from the weapons.