American Politics during the Obama Presidency

I don't know from whence the rest of you guys are watching this unfold, but I'm in a very blue part of a blue state and I can tell you two things, 1) lots people from all walks of life love Trump (seriously), including liberal bastions such as the semi-lib house wife to the Latam immigrants to the African American community, and 2) everybody hates Hillary, except for the died-in-the-wool, hardcore party loyalists. If it weren't for the super delegates, Hillary and bernie would be in a very tight match. As it stands, I expect Bernie to crush her in a few of the remaining contests which, should further embolden his supporters. The thing is that he hasn't really tried to fight her head on. He has passed on the emails issue, the failure as Secretary of State issue and the vast corruption/criminal enterprise of Clinton Inc. After all, he's just supposed to be in the race as a straw man so that she didn't run unopposed. So, think about this, Hillary is running against an avowed socialist straw man, taking 90% of the super delegates and she is barely winning. She's brought in millions of fewer votes than she had at this point in 2008.

Anyhow, I am not a Trump fanboy (but I will take him over Hillary), but I have been saying this, for months, barring some catastrophic change, Trump will win in an epic landslide against Hillary in the general election.

The biggest challenge that Trump would face would be Hillary/Bernie ticket, because it would keep the Bernie supporters from voting Trump or staying home. However, two far left candidates, in a country that has suffered mightily (on the personal, individual level with record real unemployment, etc) will not do well in the general. However, this latter point (i.e. a reconciliation between Hillary and Bernie) was always part of the deal. That is why (IMO) Bernie hasn't really tried to knock her out. When the time comes, he will fall in line with her, pledge his undying loyalty to her and he will be handsomely rewarded (at taxpayer expense, of course) for his obedience.

[QUOTE=WildWalleye;447398]Anyhow, I am not a Trump fanboy (but I will take him over Hillary), but I have been saying this, for months, barring some catastrophic change, Trump will win in an epic landslide against Hillary in the general election.[/QUOTE]Especially after 2012.

I was unfriended yesterday for this incident. One of my friends wrote "If Trump becomes President, we'll have the best looking First Family since......EVER...!!!!" I wrote "Kennedy and Jackie?" The guy unfriended me. I guess he felt it was not worthy of discussion.

I realize the definition of attractive changes over time. But Jackie was a trophy wife just like Melania. Jackie was 31 when Kennedy took office whereas Melania is 45.

Trump facially I would say is good looking but he has a funny walk. I don't find him all that graceful. He has had bad feet all his life which kept him from being drafted in the 1960s.

Kennedy was more virile than Trump at this stage in his life when he became President. More athletic certainly which was partly propaganda because he had a bad back. But if you were a kid in 1960s, you probably had read PT-109.

Kennedy had at least two known mistresses during his Presidency - Exner and Monroe.

[URL]http://edgardaily.com/en/life/2014/judith-campbell-exner-the-missing-link-between-jfk-and-the-mafia-8673[/URL]

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqolSvoWNck[/URL]

You can see the stiffness in Kennedy's back in the Monroe video.

Ah well, it is no big deal. We were just in the same high class class and did not know each well anyway. I think it is a little over sensitive though.

[QUOTE=BigBossMan;447440]Trump ... has had bad feet all his life which kept him from being drafted in the 1960s.[/QUOTE]If you believe that, I have some oceanfront property in Iowa for sale.

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447441]If you believe that, I have some oceanfront property in Iowa for sale.[/QUOTE]I was at a fairly well-known university during the Vietnam War. Bad-feet was a known way to get out of the draft and I knew one guy who used it to avoid being drafted. He is currently the president of a major environmental organization. I said to some of my friends, only half-joking, " Maybe the guys who used the foot scam are smarter than the rest of us. They know how to work the system. That's why they are all presidents now.".

At the same time, I was not volunteering to go to Vietnam either. I am from the first class that was subject to the draft lottery. I was fairly relieved to get a draft number 196. I immediately dropped out of school after receiving the number (over 100 was deemed to be safe) only to return a couple of years later.

The guys that I knew personally who received low numbers immediately enlisted in Air Force or Navy. Nobody that I know of who graduated from my high school in 1970 volunteered for the infantry.

We recently created a Vietnam Memorial at my high school which I contributed funds to build. The eight guys that died in Vietnam from my high school all graduated between 1965 and 1967. 1968 was McNamara's million I think? One of the guys who died was the student body president and another was Honor Society student. So not everyone dodged it in the 1960s.

The guy I know now who fought in the jungles says he does not really give a damn anymore. The one he remembers is Joe Namath who could play pro football but had bad knees so he could not get drafted.

California being a high tax state treats Vets fairly well. The son of a friend gets full ride at UC with a combination of state scholarships and the GI bill. He has had full medical care since he was discharged. He is about to graduate and there are a get a vet a job programs. LA County has a hire 100,000 vets program lead by the mayor of Los Angeles Garcetti who is also an officer in the Reserves. Several companies have recruiters who specialize in hiring vets.

If Trump has a good idea on how to make it better, maybe he should be more specific in his speeches. I think in California we would at least consider it. The stump speeches I have watched he just says, " We are going to take care of our Vets." In one debate I watched, maybe New Hampshire or South Carolina, I think he said there is a lot of waste and fraud in the current Vet programs. Maybe Trump can manage what we have better.

California is going to vote Clinton. If you live in Ohio, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, Colorado, Florida and Virginia, I think you are deciding for the rest of us.

So do you think Trump avoided military service because he had bad feet, or because he is a rich cocksucker? I don't criticize anyone for doing whatever to get out of military service. They ended the draft when I was 17 but I sure as fuck would not have gone to Vietnam. I would have first sought CO status and then gone to Canada or to prison instead. Cocksuckers like Bush and Trump don't have to go through the CO process or expatriate themselves because their rich daddies take care of all that.

Where is Leon Czolgosz when we need him?

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447443]So do you think Trump avoided military service because he had bad feet, or because he is a rich cocksucker? I don't criticize anyone for doing whatever to get out of military service. They ended the draft when I was 17 but I sure as fuck would not have gone to Vietnam. I would have first sought CO status and then gone to Canada or to prison instead. Cocksuckers like Bush and Trump don't have to go through the CO process or expatriate themselves because their rich daddies take care of all that.

Where is Leon Czolgosz when we need him?[/QUOTE]Trump is not a cocksucker........he is a pussy licker and from what I have seen, quite nice ones at that.

He told Howard Stern that oral sex was unimportant.

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447443]So do you think Trump avoided military service because he had bad feet, or because he is a rich cocksucker? I don't criticize anyone for doing whatever to get out of military service. [b]They ended the draft when I was 17 but I sure as fuck would not have gone to Vietnam. I would have first sought CO status and then gone to Canada or to prison instead.[/b] Cocksuckers like Bush and Trump don't have to go through the CO process or expatriate themselves because their rich daddies take care of all that.

Where is Leon Czolgosz when we need him?[/QUOTE]On Memorial Day, we know all we need to know about you. [B]Pussy[/B], is not just that which you chase.

I had a lottery number in the two hundreds so I was never getting drafted. I tried to enlisted anyway. However, the Marine Corp first and then the Army rejected me, because of flat fleet. I wore special orthopedic shoes from Stride Rite growing up. Only the Navy would take me, but as you can see the joke was on me.

Personally, I don't like, Trump, but if he had flat fleet I have sympathy. Even though they let me in with flat feet, in the early 70's the stupid U.S. Navy thought you should march around Great Lakes boot camp carrying an '03 Springfield all day. At the end of every day, my arms felt like they wanted to fall off and my feet were in agony. The F'ing irony was that we never fired the damn rifle. They were obsolete and I don't think they had firing pins anyway. Also, I never marched another day after boot camp. I think they were both just for [I]torture[/I] (character building) purposes.

I bet you wouldn't say that to Muhammad Ali :<).

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447447]I bet you wouldn't say that to Muhammad Ali :<).[/QUOTE]Certainly not to his face. Actually, Ali had been a member of the Nation of Islam for sometime and I can not judge the sincerity of his conscientious objection on religious grounds.

I apologize if I misjudged the sincerity of your CO, but it was based on the tenor of your post and my contemporaneous experience 69-73. At the time the girls were mostly genuinely opposed to the Vietnam War on moral grounds, but the guys either thought being anti-war would get them laid and/or because they just didn't want to go to Vietnam.

I would be surprised if 1 in 100 really objected on true moral or religious grounds. I even knew a few from my high school that tucked their tail between their legs and ran for the CA border. I know for a fact they had no serious moral or religious objections, just afraid of going to Vietnam.

I might be a little touchy on the subject. I went to visit my father's and my brothers' graves today. My father was a WWII vet and my brothers were Vietnam vets. My father was a marine on Guadalcanal and Tarawa. My next older brother was in the air force and my oldest bother was a marine who did back to back Vietnam tours 67-69. He saw some of the most serious shit including Khe Sanh and was wounded three times. His battalion was nicknamed "The Waking Dead" for its casualty rate, long before it became synonymous with the TV series.

I believe that Clay/Ali's stated position was 'I got no quarrel with those people.' I don't believe in war, and if everyone refused to fight, there would be no wars. It's just that simple. I don't give a rat's ass if you think I'm sincere or not, and also fuck you for calling me a pussy. Vietnam was a particularly stupid war as they were absolutely no threat to us. Oh yeah, the domino theory of communism. Well, communism failed just fine on its own merits so all of the US efforts in Vietnam were 100% futile. The war divided the country. The war fucked up the economy for a decade. The war defoliated a perfectly good agricultural country, and I commend them for coming up with the idea to plant coffee. Vietnam is now the world's #2 producer of coffee, with over double the export volume in 2014 of #3 Colombia.

Conscription is not a harbinger of an advanced country. Imperialism is the new colonialism and is quite pernicious as well. A war to stop someone like Hitler is one thing and a war to help out French colonialists is quite another. Wie went into Vietnam and started bombing and killing without having any clear goals or purpose for doing so. A bunch of GIs fucked a bunch of Vietnamese in the process and left something like half a million half-caste children to be discriminated against. It wasn't a good chapter in our history, and even as a teenager I knew I would not be participating. I'm quite comfortable with that and very glad that I was not born two or three years earlier, because I didn't end up having to deal with it. I respect the choices that others made, although quite frankly I have at least as much respect for those who went to prison rather than Vietnam.

If we end up in BA at the same time, I'd be happy to buy you a beer, or happy to fight you one-on-one. Some people may view war as a test of courage, but I just view it as a sad waste.

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447447]I bet you wouldn't say that to Muhammad Ali :<).[/QUOTE]Ali said that nobody in Vietnam ever called him a Nigger so he didn't have any problems with the Vietnamese.

Funny story , Ali tried to buy a house in one of my old my old neighborhoods when I was growing up and they would not allow it.

NO Blacks and No Jews Allowed.

Not even the Champion of the World.

Fortunately I was too young and innocent to notice the Old South and it's outdated views.

Now they even allow Mexicans!

TL.

Joking Like Usual.

Speaking of Ali, he has left the building forever!

[URL]http://abcnews.go.com/US/muhammad-ali-dies-greatest-boxer-dead-74/story?id=18391211[/URL]

[QUOTE=RcCollins;447469]Speaking of Ali, he has left the building forever!

[URL]http://abcnews.go.com/US/muhammad-ali-dies-greatest-boxer-dead-74/story?id=18391211[/URL][/QUOTE]He really was The Greatest, there'll never be anyone else like him.

Is Trump the greatest gift from the GOP to the Democrats?

This is so much more heinous than anything Hillary's been accused of regarding e-mail. Borderline treason.

[URL]http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/fbi-found-hundreds-of-classified-files-on-petraeus-biographer-broadwell%E2%80%99s-computer/ar-AAgO5C5?li=BBnbfcL[/URL]

And then there's this asshole:

[URL]http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/newscrisepolitica/minuteman-movement-founder-convicted-of-molesting-young-girl/ar-AAgOd7g?li=BBnbfcL[/URL]

I'm just sayin'.

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447487]This is so much more heinous than anything Hillary's been accused of regarding e-mail. Borderline treason.

[URL]http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/fbi-found-hundreds-of-classified-files-on-petraeus-biographer-broadwell%E2%80%99s-computer/ar-AAgO5C5?li=BBnbfcL[/URL]

And then there's this asshole:

[URL]http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/newscrisepolitica/minuteman-movement-founder-convicted-of-molesting-young-girl/ar-AAgOd7g?li=BBnbfcL[/URL]

I'm just sayin'.[/QUOTE]There is nothing borderline about Hillary's corruption and treason. Please get a grip.

We have far more to risk wiht a Hillary presidency than with a Trump prediency. So, vote Trump.*

* Definitely not my guy when tings got started. However, comnsidering where we are today? He's my guy.

[QUOTE=RevBS;447482]Is Trump the greatest gift from the GOP to the Democrats?[/QUOTE]You must not live in the US. America is more than a little tired of left wing policies that deflate the economy and keep tens of millions out of work.

I think Trump is the greatest presidential candidate ever. For the Democratic party, that is. When the Republicans lose control of the Senate, I'll like him even more.

[QUOTE=Dickhead;447511]I think Trump is the greatest presidential candidate ever. For the Democratic party, that is. When the Republicans lose control of the Senate, I'll like him even more.[/QUOTE]Good for you. Please make sure to vote for Trump.

[QUOTE=WildWalleye;447510]You must not live in the US. America is more than a little tired of left wing policies that deflate the economy and keep tens of millions out of work.[/QUOTE]There are hundreds of legal immigrants who arrive everyday who are sponsor through family relationships. And they go to work very quickly because they are willing to start.

At the bottom. Or they go to school & get the right training. And in a few years, they are more than ok. Even illegals do that. Pretty simple really, unless you like to blame.

China for jobs, and Colombia for drugs.

[QUOTE=WildWalleye;447510]You must not live in the US. America is more than a little tired of left wing policies that deflate the economy and keep tens of millions out of work.[/QUOTE]The economy is nearing is full employment. If you adjust for demographic changes, baby boomers leaving the labor force, the the economy is probably at full employment. On the other hand, income inequality is rampant. The same people who did the demographic adjustment on employment examined wages of the 26-35 year old age cohort in 2005 and 2015. The finding is that in 2015 this age cohort is making $6000 a year less than they were making in 2005. This age cohort voted for Bernie and not Trump.

The problem is what is Trump really for. Many of the policies Trump talks about in his stump speech are just metaphors. For example, McConnell has said he would block closing the border to Muslims. On the fence, I was at two economic conferences this past week, one in West LA (Democrat) and one in the Inland Empire (Republican). Both times the fence was mentioned it was a laugh line. I do not think there is much support for a fence in California. One guy actually stood up at the Inland Empire conference and said more people are migrating to Mexico now than are immigrating. "What are we going to do?" he asked. "Build a fence to keep them in.".

Obviously views in California are seldom reflective of the US as a whole.

For the last ten to twelve years I have come to BA at least twenty five times. The last twenty times I have rented apartments all in different areas of the city. I like San Telmo the best. On this trip like all others I leave my apartment and try to go a different direction and get lost. After walking for two to three hours I have no idea were I am. So here I am walking along and I stop at a cafe/pub for a refreshment and in the door comes a tranny. He talkers to the bartender for a few moments then leans over the counter and looking at his back side he has a zipper up the crack of his ass. It starts at his nut sack and goes all the way up his back side to his belt. OK so that was surprise enough but it had many stains on it. Yuck oh. I'm no prude but one must wonder how it feels to go home every night with a sore butt.

Who is not creating jobs?

[URL]http://www.politicususa.com/2015/05/23/republicans-passed-0-jobs-bills-138-days-running-congress.html[/URL]

[URL]http://kelly.house.gov/house-passed-jobs-bills-are-awaiting-action-senate[/URL]

[QUOTE=WildWalleye;447510]You must not live in the US. America is more than a little tired of left wing policies that deflate the economy and keep tens of millions out of work.[/QUOTE]

Columnist George Will has left the Republican Party over its presumptive nomination of Donald Trump.

He said Republican voters should just "make sure he (Trump) loses," then "Grit their teeth for four years.".

Even George Will, Mr. Conservative, cant stomach Trump.

[QUOTE=WildWalleye;447510]You must not live in the US. America is more than a little tired of left wing policies that deflate the economy and keep tens of millions out of work.[/QUOTE]Most of us on AP are multi-millionaires who choose to live on our SS elsewhere. Jobs are for the illegals.

One of the most entertaining & exciting presidential elections in history, is there an unwritten code that we do not discuss it?

Unemployment rate is the lowest since the Republicans were in office.

[URL]https://www.americanprogress.org/issues/economy/news/2017/01/05/295945/the-state-of-the-u-s-labor-market-pre-january-2017-jobs-release/[/URL]

[URL]https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000[/URL]

How about including the real unemployment rate - U6 which is at 9.20.

I noticed you did not mention the labor participation rate - you really going to tell me all those folks "retired".

If employment is so great why are all the "social" programs such as welfare/medicaid/food stamp skyrocketing?

You guys just never give up, Obama was an abject failure who pulled his party down with him. 8 years ago the Dem's had it all - House/Senate/Potus and now they have nothing. Back then the "talking heads" were all trumpeting the death of conservatism, today they are concerned about the death of the Democratic Party.

I agree. I have been saying through all administrations since I have been voting in the 60s.

Why can't they count the people that gave up looking for a job?

In California the unemployment lower than most States.

I walk the streets and see Help Wanted signs in restaurants, shops and stores, etc.

But, you are wrong on Obama. Jobs are way up since when he started, as is the Stock Market.

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;448402]How about including the real unemployment rate - U6 which is at 9.20.

I noticed you did not mention the labor participation rate - you really going to tell me all those folks "retired".

If employment is so great why are all the "social" programs such as welfare/medicaid/food stamp skyrocketing?

You guys just never give up, Obama was an abject failure who pulled his party down with him. 8 years ago the Dem's had it all - House/Senate/Potus and now they have nothing. Back then the "talking heads" were all trumpeting the death of conservatism, today they are concerned about the death of the Democratic Party.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;448402]How about including the real unemployment rate - U6 which is at 9.20.

I noticed you did not mention the labor participation rate - you really going to tell me all those folks "retired".

If employment is so great why are all the "social" programs such as welfare/medicaid/food stamp skyrocketing?

You guys just never give up, Obama was an abject failure who pulled his party down with him. 8 years ago the Dem's had it all - House/Senate/Potus and now they have nothing. Back then the "talking heads" were all trumpeting the death of conservatism, today they are concerned about the death of the Democratic Party.[/QUOTE]Yep. 18 million people left the ranks of the employed, over the last 8 years...and food stamps participation grew by about 20 million people...I guess I'd have to call BS on the govt's method for calculating unemployment.

[QUOTE=RevBS;447515]There are hundreds of legal immigrants who arrive everyday who are sponsor through family relationships. And they go to work very quickly because they are willing to start.

At the bottom. Or they go to school & get the right training. And in a few years, they are more than ok. Even illegals do that. Pretty simple really, unless you like to blame.

China for jobs, and Colombia for drugs.[/QUOTE]Its easy to start at the bottom when your salary amounts to a very very nice tip on top of about $65,000/yr courtesy of government subsidies, and all of it absolutely tax free. Btw, even though we the people pay into those programs (at gunpoint, mind you), we get absolutely ZERO access to any of them and have ZERO say so in any of it.

[QUOTE=HotRod11;447528]For the last ten to twelve years I have come to BA at least twenty five times. The last twenty times I have rented apartments all in different areas of the city. I like San Telmo the best. On this trip like all others I leave my apartment and try to go a different direction and get lost. After walking for two to three hours I have no idea were I am. So here I am walking along and I stop at a cafe/pub for a refreshment and in the door comes a tranny. He talkers to the bartender for a few moments then leans over the counter and looking at his back side he has a zipper up the crack of his ass. It starts at his nut sack and goes all the way up his back side to his belt. OK so that was surprise enough but it had many stains on it. Yuck oh. I'm no prude but one must wonder how it feels to go home every night with a sore butt.[/QUOTE]Lol. As for your original question, maybe its a reflection of the times. The BAs that the forum started on may be dead and gone, but it has a new direction these days as a terrific place to maintain your dollar's purchasing power ESPECIALLY if your enthusiasm to earn those dollars is equally dead. Honestly, argentina is a terrible place to meet a girl, but its a great place to take a girl. So now all i have to do is meet girl, aaaand make up enough money to take her to argentina and ... You know what, lets just get drunk and talk politics instead! :P.

Department of Defense Medal for Distinguished Public Service awarded to Obama by Obama presented by Ash Carter.

If this guy could act anymore like a third world, banana republic dictator I'm not sure how.

He awards himself the highest civilian metal from the Defense Department to add to his done nothing to deserve it but be the first black elected POTUS Nobel Peace Prize.

Keep it up big O, by the time you leave office you will have awarded yourself enough ribbons and medals to look like one of those banana republic pricks.

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;448409]Department of Defense Medal for Distinguished Public Service awarded to Obama by Obama presented by Ash Carter.

If this guy could act anymore like a third world, banana republic dictator I'm not sure how.

He awards himself the highest civilian metal from the Defense Department to add to his done nothing to deserve it but be the first black elected POTUS Nobel Peace Prize.

Keep it up big O, by the time you leave office you will have awarded yourself enough ribbons and medals to look like one of those banana republic pricks.[/QUOTE]George W. Bush and Bill Clinton both received it as well.

[QUOTE=Shawman;448406]Its easy to start at the bottom when your salary amounts to a very very nice tip on top of about $65,000/yr courtesy of government subsidies, and all of it absolutely tax free. Btw, even though we the people pay into those programs (at gunpoint, mind you), we get absolutely ZERO access to any of them and have ZERO say so in any of it.[/QUOTE]I am curious about the benefits that immigrants are eligible for. Do you have a reference for the $65,000 per year subsidy?

Thanks, Bob.

[QUOTE=AllIWantIsLove;448412]George W. Bush and Bill Clinton both received it as well.[/QUOTE]Laura Bush received the award as did Bill Clinton - George did not.

After gutting the military for 8 years this SOB awards himself this award - come on get real.

I am sure he feels he is of the same stature as McAuthor/LeMay/Weyland/Clay.

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;448414]Laura Bush received the award as did Bill Clinton - George did not.

After gutting the military for 8 years this SOB awards himself this award - come on get real.

I am sure he feels he is of the same stature as McAuthor/LeMay/Weyland/Clay.[/QUOTE]Obama did not give himself this award. He was awarded it, and the past two presidents George Bush and Bill Clinton received it too.

[URL]https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2017/01/05/obama-just-got-the-pentagons-medal-for-distinguished-public-service-its-more-common-than-critics-think/?utm_term=.aa19724ee9b8[/URL]

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Department_of_Defense_Medal_for_Distinguished_Public_Service[/URL]

Doppelganger continues to live up to his track record of misinformation if not lies. Nothing he posts in political threads is credible, IMO.

[QUOTE=AllIWantIsLove;448413]I am curious about the benefits that immigrants are eligible for. Do you have a reference for the $65,000 per year subsidy?

Thanks, Bob.[/QUOTE]Just for clarity, the $65k/yr is not all cash in pocket, its the aggregate value in total govt benefits rec'd.

[URL]http://cis.org/immigrant-welfare-use-2011[/URL] <-- the source is questionable, but it makes some good points.

[URL]http://www.fairus.org/DocServer/research-pub/TexasCostStudy_2014.pdf[/URL]

[URL]http://amac.us/illegal-immigration-cost-1/[/URL]

[URL]https://www.texmed.org/July14Journal/[/URL]

[URL]http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/how-undocumented-immigrants-sometimes-receive-medicaid-treatment/[/URL]

[URL]http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2011/04/most-illegal-immigrant-families-collect-welfare/[/URL]

And in texas, citizenship is not req'd for welfare benefits, which can also include a direct cash salary. The welfare officers have no oversight, no budget, and no accountability.