USA & World Economics

[QUOTE=RevBS;440832]And they reply, you took our land, and you kick us out. And on, and on, and on, it goes. In the end, it's the problem of not wanting to share, like everything else in life.

By the way, what is the latest on the Hatfields and the McCoys? Have not heard too much lately. They all can/t be dead? New generation, new thinking?[/QUOTE]Both sides took Esten's advice and applied for government treatment as oppressed minorities. Their combined properties are now free from all taxation and they are using government grants to build the Fuedin, Gamblin and Drinkin Casino & Hotel.

[QUOTE=RevBS;441236][URL]http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/09/opinion/joe-nocera-inversion-delusion.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=c-column-top-span-region&region=c-column-top-span-region&WT.nav=c-column-top-span-region&_r=0[/URL]

Read it and take it with some alka-seltzer.[/QUOTE]This article is absolutely bizarre. The writer recognizes that $2 trillion is parked overseas in subsidiaries of USA companies, never to return because of the USA Tax code. So what's his solution? Maybe change the system so they don't pay tax when they bring the money back to the USA to invest, grow the economy, and create jobs? Hell no! The solution is to keep the money locked outside the USA forever.

Interesting though. I appreciate your contributing that Reverend. The USC law professor points out that foreign companies can loan money to USA subsidiaries without creating taxable income, except for the interest received by the parent. But if a USA company borrows from a foreign subsidiary, the entire amount of the loan is taxable*. And that's a large part of what drives inversions. There are easy fixes that would simplify the tax code, help grow the economy, and actually increase the amount of taxes paid by corporations. They won't happen though, because of the desire of some politicians, mostly Democrats, to screw the corporations.

*This is an example of "Subpart F" income, reported on IRS Form 5471. It's incredibly difficult to calculate, and an example of how truly fucked up the USA tax code is. Congressmen and Jack Lew should be forced at gunpoint to fill in a Form 5471 and calculate tax owed as a result of loans from a foreign subsidiary to a USA parent. They would quickly become advocates for tax simplification.

Can anybody tell me how Elon Musk was able to seduce Wall Street and made electrical cars sexy. When all I hear on AP is "drill, baby, drill" and lots of laughter.

[QUOTE=RevBS;441336]Can anybody tell me how Elon Musk was able to seduce Wall Street and made electrical cars sexy. When all I hear on AP is "drill, baby, drill" and lots of laughter.[/QUOTE]Hollywood's liberal elite want them because that proves they are politically correct. Cool people wanting them makes the cars cool too.

All sources of energy are needed, so there is no choice between drill baby drill and electrical cars. We just need to stop subsidizing certain types of energy and let profit seekers figure out how to make renewable energy products that can compete with hydrocarbon energy.

[QUOTE=Dccpa;441337] We just need to stop subsidizing certain types of energy[/QUOTE]And stop using the tax code to subsidize certain types of lifestyles, such as marriage, homeownership, and children. But the good news is, the last tobacco subsidies go out next month. And the funny thing is, the few US tobacco growers who remain after the shakeout are (wait for it): [B]profitable on their own![/B].

Good luck trying to wean our Latin friends from subsidies, though. It's like mothers' milk to them.

Should I clean out the shoe boxes and invest in Alibaba? Can the average Joe get even close enough to have a sniff?

Depends on whether you view shares as pieces of paper like Esten, or actual ownership in a business, as I do. There's probably a quick buck to be made if you are allocated shares in the IPO and sell shortly thereafter. As to being a long term holder, this company is scary. It's a Cayman Islands holding company whose legal ownership of Chinese businesses is tenuous. Some of the businesses are owned through Jack Ma, the CEO, and not directly by Alibaba. I had the unfortunate experience of being a shareholder in a company with a similar structure. The insiders sucked the money out of the parent, stole the chops (company seals) of the Chinese subsidiaries, and then made off with the Chinese assets. Minority shareholders were left with paper. Hey, maybe Esten is right.

While this is a little like comparing a whale to minnows, other Chinese public companies that have their main listing in markets besides China and Hong Kong have been fools' plays. Alibaba chose to list in the USA because they couldn't get the Hong Kong or Chinese stock exchanges to agree to their crooked voting structure, where insiders will be able to control the company with a minority ownership position.

It is hours before the results of the referendum is released, what will it be? The astronomical high turn out to vote can only mean one result, independence of Scotland. Of course, I have been wrong many times.

Changes, evolution, nothing can stop history. Look out, Spain! How will the USA look like in 50 years?

[QUOTE=RevBS;441356] The astronomical high turn out to vote can only mean one result, independence of Scotland. [snip]

[/QUOTE]Is that egg I see on your face? ROFLMAO.

[QUOTE=Punter127;441361]Is that egg I see on your face? ROFLMAO.[/QUOTE]No egg on my face, but than I am American, I am incapable of shame. It was a very close call, and Cameron had to mortgage his wife to salvage the vote. But I was happy that I could help you have your moment of triumph. I remember shaking hands with you in Pattaya about the election in 2012, but somehow we forgot to decide on the bet. And I also forgot to needle you on that.

[B]Sure looks like egg to me.[/B]

[QUOTE=RevBS;441364]No egg on my face, but than I am American, I am incapable of shame. It was a very close call, and Cameron had to mortgage his wife to salvage the vote.[/QUOTE]Surely you knew of Camerons actions before you proclaimed the "independence of Scotland" as the only possible outcome because of the "astronomical high turn out".

It's amazing how rash statements have a way of coming back to haunt you.

Just for the record Flexible Horn predicted this outcome months ago, and he was spot on.

[QUOTE=Punter127;441376][B]Sure looks like egg to me.[/B]

Surely you knew of Camerons actions before you proclaimed the "independence of Scotland" as the only possible outcome because of the "astronomical high turn out".

It's amazing how rash statements have a way of coming back to haunt you.

Just for the record Flexible Horn predicted this outcome months ago, and he was spot on.[/QUOTE]I am glad I can make your day! Kudos to Flexible Horn, a very deserving fellow.

And so what, if I am the king of rash statements!

[QUOTE=RevBS;441344]Should I clean out the shoe boxes and invest in Alibaba? Can the average Joe get even close enough to have a sniff?[/QUOTE]For the average Joe, that's a terrible investment based completely on speculation. Might as well just go to the casino.

[QUOTE=Riina;441379]For the average Joe, that's a terrible investment based completely on speculation. Might as well just go to the casino.[/QUOTE]I just thought that since I missed out on Google, that I might as well go double or nothing.

[QUOTE=Riina;441379]For the average Joe, that's a terrible investment based completely on speculation. Might as well just go to the casino.[/QUOTE]Well, they are not really similar because at the casino, the rules are clearly stated and all customers are treated equally. With IPOs, not so much.