American Politics during the Obama Presidency

[QUOTE=Stan Da Man;419680]Lest you take my poor attempt at humor out of context, that post and its subject line were a direct response to Exon's post about 5 earlier titled "For you Republican Motherfuckers." That may not excuse the title completely. But, in my defense, I would submit that those who give must be willing to receive. And, for Exon, the word "Motherfucker" is something of a term of endearment.[/QUOTE]I am aquainted with the "gentleman" in question, understood.

I saw a flow chart the other day showing the consolodation of the banks down to the big 4, I was shocked. I knew there had been some trimming down but my mind has been on my studies the last few years and I hadn't noticed the extent.

It is great to see this Occupy Wall Street movement. What strikes me though, is why did it take so long for people to start raising their voice about this? It's probably because until recently there was simply little media coverage on this topic. And it's about time this became a front-and-center issue.

What are they protesting about? From the 'We Are The 99%' slogan it should be obvious - it's about the huge economic inequality between the top 1% and everyone else. More broadly, the top few %.

It's not about business itself. They don't care about the mom-and-pop and many other small businesses in the country. They are more concerned about large corporations, like Walmart, that help consolidate wealth in a few hands, sometimes by putting small business competitors out of business or acquiring them. And they are especially concerned how the financial industry concentrates wealth in a variety of ways, lobbying politicians and pressuring Corporate America.

I've posted on this topic many times before. A recent article in WSJ lays it out:

The Wealthiest 5% Grabbed Most of America's Gains
[url]http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2011/09/16/the-top-5-grabbed-most-of-the-americas-gains/[/url]

[QUOTE]A new chart from the Economic Policy Institute, using data from NYU Economist Ed Wolff, shows that more than 80% of the nation’s wealth gains between 1983 and 2009 went to the wealthiest top 5%. The top 1% gained 40% of the nation’s total wealth gain, while the next 4% gained 41.5%.[/QUOTE]
81.5% of wealth gains went to the top 5%! So much for growing the pie! Truly unbelievable. If you could go back in time and ask the Founding Fathers, if the society they envisioned was one where the top 5% receive 81.5% of the wealth, what do you think their reaction would be? They would likely find the notion absurd.

I agree it's not entirely a red vs blue issue. Economic inequality has been increasing for decades under both parties. So what is the cause?

[u]The common denominator is free-market capitalism[/u]. Manipulated by the rich elite and their lobbyists. And supported by millions of people who don't understand the problem, or refuse to believe that capitalism itself could be part of the problem.

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]The Wealthiest 5% Grabbed Most of America's Gains.[/QUOTE]Here's how I read that headline:

"The Wealthiest 5% [strike]Grabbed[/strike] Created Most of America's Gains

[QUOTE=Jackson; 419692]Here's how I read that headline:

"The Wealthiest 5% [strike]Grabbed[/strike] Created Most of America's Gains[/QUOTE]Sorry Jefe not prior to 2001, until then the engine that drove the majority of wealth creation was middle class home appreciation. Since 2001 there has been a fundimental shift in accumulation of wealth in La Tierra de las Gordas. Not my opinion boss.

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]It is great to see this Occupy Wall Street movement. What strikes me though, is why did it take so long for people to start raising their voice about this?[/QUOTE]Oh, I don't know. Maybe it was because they have the collective organizational abilities of a bag of rocks?

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]They don't care about the mom-and-pop and many other small businesses in the country.[/QUOTE]Neither does Obama.

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]81.5% of wealth gains went to the top 5%![/QUOTE]That's a great Class Warfare slogan, but it has nothing to do with why some people are poor.

Ask yourself this: Bill Gates became a multi-billionaire in the past 30 years. Are you any poorer because he made himself wealthy?

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]If you could go back in time and ask the Founding Fathers, if the society they envisioned was one where the top 5% receive 81.5% of the wealth, what do you think their reaction would be.[/QUOTE]They probably wouldn't think anything about it at all, given that this was the approximate distribution of wealth at the time. Remember all those "dead white men" who at the time risked everything they owned organizing the agricultural endeavors that created the wealth at the time.

[QUOTE=Esten;419690]Economic inequality has been increasing for decades under both parties.[/QUOTE]You are correct in that those who worked hard and created wealth for themselves are much better off than the lazy parasites who sat on their collective asses and waited for their government checks.

So was watching the Fox political show, The Five. Poor Juan Williams played the token fool. I guess I am quite slow, but it finally occurred to me that Fox is pretty much a tabloid station. At times, The Five does remind me of this forum. Now, let's see who plays who? Ok, ok, just joking. I love all you guys.

Esten is just beating the Class Warfare drum again. I doubt he has really listened to what the folks are saying in the War on Wall Street bunch. Basically it's; 'Give me a free home, education, food and any other material support I want, YOU pay for it while I sit on my lazy ass. '

This redistribution idea worked really well in Russia, Cuba, and North Korea. Why don't these guys move to the worker's paradise they so love and admire? Probably because they would be lined up against a wall and shot.

To preface my following remarks even liberals have to admit Steve Jobs and Bill Gates are the exception to the rule and there will always be those who make massive change through innovation and they will reap the rewards.

That said, I am going to agree CEO / Executive pay is way out of sync with reality; nobody is worth hundreds of millions of dollars in pay no matter who they are! What I find hilarious is the very thing liberals are complaining about, overpaid executives, is something they CAUSED! Do your homework, back in the 70's those folks who never held a job but went from undergrad to grad to professorships as 'business experts' decided the American business model was too conservative and needed to be more aggressive. To this end they proposed linking executive pay to performance. Back then CEOs / executives enjoyed a pay rate in the tens of multiples of their regular employees. As with all things the law of unintended consequences came into play with one wild scheme after another to 'boost company performance' had less and less to do with the true value of the company but were only designed to boost executive pay under the 'new rules'. Each successive round of schemes pushed the envelope a little further until now we have folks making 100s of millions of dollars in pay.

We can get into where the money should have gone later; reinvested in the company to produce more jobs and to the investors.

[QUOTE=Jackson; 419692]Here's how I read that headline:

"The Wealthiest 5% [strike]Grabbed[/strike] Created Most of America's Gains[/QUOTE]Most people have probably heard of John Paulson. He's a billionaire hedge fund manager, most famous for generating returns of up to 600% by betting against mortgages in 2008 as the market crashed.

In 2010, Mr. Paulson personally made more than [u]$5 Billion in profits[/u]. To put that in context, that's equivalent to 100, 000 workers making $50K. Or 5000 CEOs getting a $1 Million bonus.

Trader Racks Up a Second Epic Gain
[url]http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704268104576108390332589096.html[/url]

How did he do it? By doing what all hedge funds do - trading in stocks, ETFs, and other financial instruments. In some cases using high-speed computers with sophisticated algorithms to enter and exit trades in mere seconds. Playing both the short and long side of trades.

Did Paulson [i]create[/i] $5 Billion in wealth?

Or did Paulson [i]extract[/i] $5 Billion in wealth?

[QUOTE=Esten; 419703]Most people have probably heard of John Paulson. He's a billionaire hedge fund manager, most famous for generating returns of up to 600% by betting against mortgages in 2008 as the market crashed.

In 2010, Mr. Paulson personally made more than [u]$5 Billion in profits[/u]. To put that in context, that's equivalent to 100, 000 workers making $50K. Or 5000 CEOs getting a $1 Million bonus.

Did Paulson [i]create[/i] $5 Billion in wealth?

Or did Paulson [i]extract[/i] $5 Billion in wealth?[/QUOTE]Esten,

I would not be surprised if John Paulson paid less taxes than Buffet's personal secretary.

Long Live the REPUBLICAN PARTY! - hehehe

[QUOTE=Moveon; 419707]Esten,

I would not be surprised if John Paulson paid less taxes than Buffet's personal secretary.

Long Live the REPUBLICAN PARTY!. Hehehe[/QUOTE]Can't we get back to talking about getting laid boys?

TL

P.S - National Socialist Untill The Day I Die !

Some of you say you want to do away with Unions.

This one is sort of a Dictatorial Union.

Let's Break this one!

I did not write this, just passing it on.

I could not find any thing negative on Urban Legends. Com.

Subject: Let us all speak up!

Warren Buffett, in a recent interview with CNBC, offers one of the best quotes about the debt ceiling:

"I could end the deficit in 5 minutes," he told CNBC."You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election.

The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only.

3 months & 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971. Before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc.

Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land. All because of public pressure.

Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise.

In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.

Congressional Reform Act of 2011.

1. No Tenure / No Pension.

A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.

2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security.

All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.

3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.

4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3.

5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.

6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.

7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen.

Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term (s) , then go home and back to work.

If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the USA) to receive the message. Maybe it is time.

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS!

WT I agree with you completely on this one. It is a great idea, but I fear it has an ice cube's chance in hell of making it through.

I've posted several times regarding resending elected official's healthcare and retirement systems. They send the rest of us down the path of Medicare and Social Security but exempt themselves so they keep their 'private' plan.

By the way, Congress has to VOTE AGAINST IT'S PAY RAISES so as not to receive one. Many years ago they faded so much heat every time they passed pay raise for themselves they hit upon a strategy of making the raises automatic and requiring a majority vote to reject them.

Who are you, and what are your ransom demands for the safe return of WorldTravel69?

[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 419709]Some of you say you want to do away with Unions.

This one is sort of a Dictatorial Union.

Let's Break this one!

I did not write this, just passing it on.

I could not find any thing negative on Urban Legends. Com.

Subject: Let us all speak up!

Warren Buffett, in a recent interview with CNBC, offers one of the best quotes about the debt ceiling:

"I could end the deficit in 5 minutes," he told CNBC."You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP, all sitting members of Congress are ineligible for re-election.

The 26th amendment (granting the right to vote for 18 year-olds) took only.

3 months & 8 days to be ratified! Why? Simple! The people demanded it. That was in 1971. Before computers, e-mail, cell phones, etc.

Of the 27 amendments to the Constitution, seven (7) took 1 year or less to become the law of the land. All because of public pressure.

Warren Buffet is asking each addressee to forward this email to a minimum of twenty people on their address list; in turn ask each of those to do likewise.

In three days, most people in The United States of America will have the message. This is one idea that really should be passed around.

Congressional Reform Act of 2011.

1. No Tenure / No Pension.

A Congressman collects a salary while in office and receives no pay when they are out of office.

2. Congress (past, present & future) participates in Social Security.

All funds in the Congressional retirement fund move to the Social Security system immediately. All future funds flow into the Social Security system, and Congress participates with the American people. It may not be used for any other purpose.

3. Congress can purchase their own retirement plan, just as all Americans do.

4. Congress will no longer vote themselves a pay raise. Congressional pay will rise by the lower of CPI or 3.

5. Congress loses their current health care system and participates in the same health care system as the American people.

6. Congress must equally abide by all laws they impose on the American people.

7. All contracts with past and present Congressmen are void effective 1/1/12. The American people did not make this contract with Congressmen.

Congressmen made all these contracts for themselves. Serving in Congress is an honor, not a career. The Founding Fathers envisioned citizen legislators, so ours should serve their term (s) , then go home and back to work.

If each person contacts a minimum of twenty people then it will only take three days for most people (in the USA) to receive the message. Maybe it is time.

THIS IS HOW YOU FIX CONGRESS![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=TejanoLibre; 419708]Can't we get back to talking about getting laid boys?

TL.

P. S. National Socialist Untill The Day I Die![/QUOTE]Tambien. TL

We are Mostly Lawyers. As you know, each of us have different views and can not agree on what the amount should be, much less anything else.

[QUOTE=Jackson;419714]Who are you, and what are your ransom demands for the safe return of WorldTravel69?[/QUOTE]