American Politics during the Obama Presidency

[QUOTE=PeterSideburn;433385]The goal is to become European and to remove all guns. Also, you don't start by taking away the constitutional rights of law abiding citizens to decrease criminal activity. It is just stupid. If you are correct then why didn't we see an increase in gun deaths after the assault rifle ban expired?[/QUOTE]Peter, I can assure you there is no goal to remove all guns (at least with any significant support). Comments some folks may make, including myself, about banning all guns, are entirely hypothetical. It's in the context of "as a last resort", after first trying to reduce gun violence through sensible approaches which also protect gun ownership. Even then, it's clear a ban is a near-impossibility based on gun support levels and the need to amend the Constitution. So it's 100% hypothetical.

I understand some politicians and lobbyists have made statements like "You and I are literally surrounded. The gun-grabbers in the Senate are about to launch an all-out-assault on the Second Amendment." and "They're coming for your guns." (words from Mitch McConnell). But these are simply ploys to get gun owners worked up, attempts to manipulate through lies and fear. The truth is there was no proposal whatsoever in the Senate to take away any legally owned guns.

BTW, background checks and an assault weapons ban don't take away one's constitutional right to own a gun. Mass shootings are up since the assault weapons ban expired, but support for this measure is arguably driven by mere common sense.

You should all read 'Inevitable Revolutions,' by Walter Lafeber.

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;433390]The Democrats in the Senate who voted "NO" did listen to the MAJORITY in their districts as well as the Republicans who voted NO. You just don't seem to get the point here.[/QUOTE]I am pretty sure there were Senators who voted NO on the background check amendment, from states where a MAJORITY supported expanded background checks.

Doppel if you disagree with this, how about let's put it to a test. I got $500 that says I am correct. Do we have a bet?

[QUOTE=Esten;433395]Peter, I can assure you there is no goal to remove all guns (at least with any significant support). Comments some folks may make, including myself, about banning all guns, are entirely hypothetical. It's in the context of "as a last resort", after first trying to reduce gun violence through sensible approaches which also protect gun ownership. Even then, it's clear a ban is a near-impossibility based on gun support levels and the need to amend the Constitution. So it's 100% hypothetical.

I understand some politicians and lobbyists have made statements like "You and I are literally surrounded. The gun-grabbers in the Senate are about to launch an all-out-assault on the Second Amendment." and "They're coming for your guns." (words from Mitch McConnell). But these are simply ploys to get gun owners worked up, attempts to manipulate through lies and fear. The truth is there was no proposal whatsoever in the Senate to take away any legally owned guns.

BTW, background checks and an assault weapons ban don't take away one's constitutional right to own a gun. Mass shootings are up since the assault weapons ban expired, but support for this measure is arguably driven by mere common sense.[/QUOTE]You know, you do make sense.

[QUOTE=BlackShirt;433400]Once in a while,

You know, you do make sense.[/QUOTE][B]ROFLMAO[/B]

My friend you are unbelievably naïve!

Don't fall for his wile, he's a skilled propagandist.

[b][u]Gun Crime Prosecutions Down 40% Under Obama.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://www.newsmax.com/TedNugent/Gun-Crime-Prosecutions-Down/2013/04/30/id/502125[/URL]

[b][u]Obama's Chicago Dead Last In Federal Gun Prosecutions.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/040213-650124-chicago-dead-last-in-federal-gun-prosecutions.htm[/URL]

[b][u]Figures. Obama Increased Budget By a Trillion Dollars But Cut in Half Domestic Bombing Prevention.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://exposingliberallies.blogspot.com/2013/04/obama-cut-domestic-bombing-prevention.html[/URL]

[b][u]Did someone say “Shameful”?[/b][/u]

Here is a few that just got taken off the market in my area. Not good trying to sell them to the Cops.

[QUOTE=Punter127;433428][b][u]Gun Crime Prosecutions Down 40% Under Obama.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://www.newsmax.com/TedNugent/Gun-Crime-Prosecutions-Down/2013/04/30/id/502125[/URL]

[b][u]Obama's Chicago Dead Last In Federal Gun Prosecutions.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/040213-650124-chicago-dead-last-in-federal-gun-prosecutions.htm[/URL]

[b][u]Figures. Obama Increased Budget By a Trillion Dollars But Cut in Half Domestic Bombing Prevention.[/b][/u]

[URL]http://exposingliberallies.blogspot.com/2013/04/obama-cut-domestic-bombing-prevention.html[/URL]

[b][u]Did someone say “Shameful”?[/b][/u][/QUOTE]

Some of you complain about this government having tooooo many Regulations.

You could always do this . . .

[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;433435]Some of you complain about this government having tooooo many Regulations.

You cold always do this . . .[/QUOTE]

cold or could?

That is known as the fallacy of the Excluded Middle.

For my view on the subject see:

[URL]http://www.theobjectivestandard.com/blog/index.php/2012/11/where-does-valid-law-end-and-regulation-begin/[/URL]

Leftists will of course reticule it.

Don B.

Esten, since it has been demonstrated polls don't mean much, I'll do you one better. $500 says even with your so called "majority" no legislation is passed for the Obamations signature. Are we on? Is you faith in the so called "majority" strong enough?

My proof is the Democrats who are up for election have decided there is a majority who will throw them out of office at the mid-terms if they vote for this BS legislation so they have declined to do so.

Obama and the gun grabbers are now in [b]lie and wait[/b] mode.
Which in this case means tell a lot of lies and wait for the next crisis (even if it's a false flag) to push their gun agenda in congress.

I thought you were smarter than that.

No one wants to take your guns away, just keep them out of the wrong hands.

Or do you have something to hide?

[QUOTE=Punter127;433441]Obama and the gun grabbers are now in [b]lie and wait[/b] mode.
Which in this case means tell a lot of lies and wait for the next crisis (even if it's a false flag) to push their gun agenda in congress.[/QUOTE]

So the NRA had it's convention down in Houston this weekend. Maybe some of our AP gun owners were down there, shopping for the latest Zombie Targets. I wonder if Houston is a more gun-friendly part of the state; here's what the biggest newspaper in Dallas wrote:

And speaking of cowards, the Senate gun vote is an appalling victory for hardliners and hypocrites
[URL]http://dallasmorningviewsblog.dallasnews.com/2013/04/and-speaking-of-cowards-the-senate-gun-vote-is-an-appalling-for-hardliners-and-hypocrites.html/[/URL]

I listened to some of the speeches. It was mostly far-right extremist programming-- the second amendment is under attack, the victims are the poor law-abiding gun owners, etc etc. They celebrate the defeat of the Senate vote on background checks, even though a clear majority (74%) of NRA members support universal background checks. A festival of self-pity, self-praise and self-delusion.

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;433440]Esten, since it has been demonstrated polls don't mean much, I'll do you one better. $500 says even with your so called "majority" no legislation is passed for the Obamations signature. Are we on? Is you faith in the so called "majority" strong enough?[/QUOTE]Nice pivot. But the difference is, I never made any statement on this. It's clear there are many elected representatives who are willing to sell out to lobbyists, instead of listening to the 90% of Americans who support background checks. Time will be needed to replace enough of these "representatives" for a re-vote. You're offer is rather stacked in your favor, so I'll pass. Let's return to what you, DID make a statement on:

[QUOTE=Doppelganger;433390]The Democrats in the Senate who voted "NO" did listen to the MAJORITY in their districts as well as the Republicans who voted NO. You just don't seem to get the point here.[/QUOTE]I contend there were Senators who voted NO on the background check amendment, from states where a MAJORITY supported expanded background checks. $500 says I am correct. Do we have a bet? If you can't back up your own statements, we'll all know what you're really all about.

Your 90% polls are dust in the wind. The true poll is the ballot box which the Dems in the senate fear which is why they will not vote for it. They fear the majority at election time more than the poll. Do we have a bet? How can it be stacked in my favor if you are so sure of your Super Majority of 90%?