[url]http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2012/08/24/americas-descent-poverty-paul-craig-roberts/[/url]
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[url]http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2012/08/24/americas-descent-poverty-paul-craig-roberts/[/url]
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;425760]I can see it now. Just like the rest of the Republican Politicians.[/QUOTE]So, one lone Republican candidate makes one remark that is universally condemned by every other Republican, and yet the Democrats continue to ignore these condemnations and pretend that the one lone candidate speaks for every Republican.
Gentlemen, please do not let the Liberals divert your attention from what's really important:
[size=3][b]8.3% unemployment and $1,000,000,000,000 annual budget deficits![/b][/size]
Thanks,
Jackson
[QUOTE=Mpexy; 425751]Esten. Other than the singular exception of silver spoon inheritance, so let's leave that aside for now, curious what your take is on how most wealthy non-job creators became wealthy in the first place? Whether they are currently creating new jobs or not at the moment, where do you think that capital came from? [/QUOTE]
All sorts of ways. High-paying jobs, entrepreneurs, authors, inventors, real-estate and financial investments come to mind.
[QUOTE]Do you not imagine many created income for others whether having direct employees or not? And do you comsider sitting on wealth to be some sin or unfair somehow?[/QUOTE]No doubt some of the wealth trickles down. But only a fraction, and not necessarily into the local economy. Sitting on wealth is not bad per se. As Jackson says, it's their money. BUT.... that does not exempt them from playing a role in addressing our economic challenges, which includes our $1,000,000,000,000 annual budget deficits. Further, when tax cuts for the wealthy are sold as good for the economy (aka "trickle-down"), and then these people sit on their money, this is evidence of flawed economic policy.
[QUOTE]Last. Really curious whether you've personally created one or more incremental new jobs?[/QUOTE]I have contributed to the consumer spending which is credited with supporting most of the jobs in this country, which would include the 4.5 Million private sector jobs created in the economic recovery. That includes local entrepreneurs who I've hired to do work for me, such as landscaping. The consumer is just as important as the businessman.
[QUOTE=Esten;425794]I have contributed to the consumer spending which is credited with supporting most of the jobs in this country, which would include the 4.5 Million private sector jobs created in the economic recovery. That includes local entrepreneurs who I've hired to do work for me, such as landscaping. The consumer is just as important as the businessman.[/QUOTE]
NO.
What was so hard about Mplexy's question Esten. Being a consumer doesn't create a job, it merely supports an already existing job. Why could you not answer his question? No big deal if you are not a job creator. No big deal at all! You are obviously risk adverse with whatever capital is at your disposal, if any (LOL). Most folks are not cut out to make it happen on their own in this big bad world. Not everyone is destined to be a chief, we need indians. Just say NO, I have never created a job through my own innovation or risk taking business venture. It's all good. I am somewhat surprised by your response though? Are you ashamed of your dependence on others to make a living? Don't be dude! Your kind never seems to give credit where credit is due. We all understand, your position is clear for everyone to see. Tick. Tick. Tick. Dude. Better put away some of your covetted salary starting tomorrow so you can afford our bet. Monger on Dude. Toymann.
Ps. You hired a kid to mow your lawn and you think you are now a job creator? IALOTFLMAO!
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425709]Sure the poor will spend the money you give them. And that will foster even more dependence upon the government. Food rots in the fields because those poor people would rather get a handout from the government rather than work. Time to let them learn that if you don't work, you don't eat. They will adjust quickly.[/QUOTE]If there were some great abundance of jobs available, but people unwilling to take them, you'd figure Romney would be all over this. But Romney tells us there are millions of people looking for work but no jobs.
You probably saw some show on Fox News, and concluded there was some major epidemic of laziness. When in fact it's probably a limited phenomenon, in certain areas, a limited number of jobs involved, and a multitude of reasons the jobs aren't being filled, not just people getting a handout being lazy.
Let's see you back up your post with some facts and data, and see how big this problem really is.
[QUOTE=Esten; 425796]If there were some great abundance of jobs available, but people unwilling to take them, you'd figure Romney would be all over this. But Romney tells us there are millions of people looking for work but no jobs.
You probably saw some show on Fox News, and concluded there was some major epidemic of laziness. When in fact it's probably a limited phenomenon, in certain areas, a limited number of jobs involved, and a multitude of reasons the jobs aren't being filled, not just people getting a handout being lazy.
Let's see you back up your post with some facts and data, and see how big this problem really is.[/QUOTE]Esten you are quite capable of looking up the articles yourself and at a minimum you should find articles on this issue from the US, New Zealand & Germany. Of course the number of jobs are limited, but the true question is why didn't any of those people who are drawing unemployment or welfare take those jobs? There are no multitude of reasons for the failure of those people to work. There were quotes in the articles from people stating that they could make as much by not working, so why work. Why don't you explain why people on welfare should be allowed to continue on welfare when jobs they are qualified to do go unfilled? I have a relative who works in a governmental disability office. Years ago, she was sympathetic to anyone filing a claim. Now she understands that most people applying for disability are quite capable of working.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but I don't watch any news shows.
[QUOTE=Dccpa; 425801]Esten you are quite capable of looking up the articles yourself and at a minimum you should find articles on this issue from the US, New Zealand & Germany. Of course the number of jobs are limited, but the true question is why didn't any of those people who are drawing unemployment or welfare take those jobs? There are no multitude of reasons for the failure of those people to work. There were quotes in the articles from people stating that they could make as much by not working, so why work. Why don't you explain why people on welfare should be allowed to continue on welfare when jobs they are qualified to do go unfilled? I have a relative who works in a governmental disability office. Years ago, she was sympathetic to anyone filing a claim. Now she understands that most people applying for disability are quite capable of working.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but I don't watch any news shows.[/QUOTE]Who ever is saying Obama will not be creating any new jobs is totally wrong. There will be 10's of thousands of new IRS agents to be hired to enforce Omaba (Romney) care! That's the type of job creation that we get when we continue to vote for nanny state candidates (Republicans included)
Fred
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425801].but the true question is why didn't any of those people who are drawing unemployment or welfare take those jobs?[/quote]Because when you create a safety net, some people will deliberately fall into it.
Unemployment and welfare are two prime examples of why liberal policies will always fail because they're based on completely inaccurate models of human behavior.
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425801]Why don't you explain why people on welfare should be allowed to continue on welfare when jobs they are qualified to do go unfilled?[/QUOTE]Because they vote for Democrats.
[QUOTE=Esten; 425796]If there were some great abundance of jobs available, but people unwilling to take them, you'd figure Romney would be all over this. But Romney tells us there are millions of people looking for work but no jobs.
You probably saw some show on Fox News, and concluded there was some major epidemic of laziness. When in fact it's probably a limited phenomenon, in certain areas, a limited number of jobs involved, and a multitude of reasons the jobs aren't being filled, not just people getting a handout being lazy.
Let's see you back up your post with some facts and data, and see how big this problem really is.[/QUOTE]Esten, you are making it too easy to knock the ball out of the park on this one.
There is an epidemic of laziness and this epidemic is fueled by ever increasing government handouts from Welfare, Food Stamps. 99 Weeks of Unemployment Payments, and now the great scam being perpetrated on Social Security for disability.
You want numbers and facts; they abound on this site with the well documented increases in ALL these pet Democrat projects to generate votes from a permanent underclass created by the Democrat party. Make them dependent and keep them dependent, that's Obama's slogan.
Surely you can not be so blind to not see it is the increase in 'entitlement ' spending which is driving the country under
Please show me statistics indicative of a relationship between the increase (or decrease) in welfare spending and the increase (decrease) in the duration of federal support the recipients had.
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425709]Sure the poor will spend the money you give them. And that will foster even more dependence upon the government. .[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Matt Psyche;425816]Please show me statistics indicative of a relationship between the increase (or decrease) in welfare spending and the increase (decrease) in the duration of federal support the recipients had.[/QUOTE]What is this decrease in welfare spending that you are talking about? That is a strange concept in the world today. Do you know anyone who if given more free money / services doesn't become more dependent upon that money / services? It is called human nature Matt.
Rather than me prove myself to you and Esten, why don't you prove me wrong?
You are the one who originally and initially stated that the welfare spending makes the poor more dependent on it. Did you just say that without seeing any indicators?
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425818]Rather than me prove myself to you and Esten, why don't you prove me wrong?[/QUOTE]
Waste Management is complaining that they are being deluged with untold millions of faded Obama posters in their trash collections. CGWNF (college graduates with no future) have enjoyed Obama about as much as they can.
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, as a sitting administration official, does not have any role at the Democratic National Convention next week in Charlotte. But she seems to gone out of her way to avoid the festivities, as she is traveling this week and next to the Cook Islands, Indonesia, China, Timor-Leste, Brunei, and Russia.
Cook Islands. Good choice. Smart girl. Stay as far away from Obama as possible. Obama is a stain on the fabric of America
The Impossible Dream!
He and his party can not even count, let alone balance the Budget.
Even screwing the Middle Class will not help.
[QUOTE=Dccpa;425801]Esten you are quite capable of looking up the articles yourself[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Dccpa;425818]Rather than me prove myself to you and Esten, why don't you prove me wrong?[/QUOTE]Great job convincing us with all those facts and data.
[QUOTE=Toymann;425795]Ps. You hired a kid to mow your lawn and you think you are now a job creator? IALOTFLMAO![/QUOTE]Actually it was a guy probably in his 50's, running his own business by himself. I paid him a few hundred bucks to bring some machines to aerate, thatch and seed my lawn in the spring. The lawn is looking good, though I still have some more work to do.
What do you think was a bigger factor for this man deciding to start his own business. Tax cuts on his personal income, or consumer demand for his service?
[QUOTE=El Alamo; 425850]Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, as a sitting administration official, does not have any role at the Democratic National Convention next week in Charlotte. But she seems to gone out of her way to avoid the festivities, as she is traveling this week and next to the Cook Islands, Indonesia, China, Timor-Leste, Brunei, and Russia.
Cook Islands. Good choice. Smart girl. Stay as far away from Obama as possible. Obama is a stain on the fabric of America[/QUOTE]Coffee stain, soy sauce stain, molasses stain, barbeque stain? Does not look too good on the white tablecloth? Finally, I get you.
Sounded Senile.
That is a big highlight for the republican party.
He has No Clue about the rest of the World's problems.
Come on Guys, you have been on his side for so long, and he does not have a Clue about you or I, and the rest of the world.
He read a Speech written for him, not his Words, from His Heart.
Come on Guys, I know You, You and I have More Brains, you and I do want is this Dumb Fuck picketing Your Pocket.
This is not Argentina, where you know what is going on, this is home and you can not see the writing On The Wall?
Think for Yourself?
On Twitter they say it is not a good Report.
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;425870]Twiter says not a good Report.[/QUOTE]Glad you are starting to see the writing on the wall WT69. You are now referencing twitter as your source. IALOTFLMAO!
You really lead a goofy and disconnected existance dude. The fact you would prefer Obamanation / Pelosi / Ried to the class act you watched tonight is truely a sad statement. This baby is all over but for the crying. Predicted this long ago. It's just a matter of time till the fat lady sings. Can't wait to see my boy slice and dice Obomanation in the debates. Your boy without telepromter on-board will be quite the show. Sorry you don't get it brother but at your age, sadly you never will! Maybe you'll do better in your next life? You seem pretty confused and sour in this one. As El Alamo put it so eloquently, you aspire to send pee wee herman to the plate in the bottom of the ninth needing a huge rally to win the day. I'm good calling up babe ruth or mickey mantle when the going gets tough! Great convention with some really cool chica speakers (Ann, Condi and Martinez rocked the house). Ryan was exellent and Romney closed the deal "big time". I know what you heard tonight from Romney didn't fit with your self-fullfilled prophecy but sadly thats all about you and nothing to do with Romney. It never fails to amaze me how dems love to howl at the moon, whistle past the cemetary, in spite of what is right in front of them. Tick. Tick. Tick. It's just a matter of time now. Say Hi to Nancy for me Dude. Toymann.
Ps. Bye the way. Just watch the bounce that this convention gives Romney with women voters. Romney has already closed the gap to 10 points. Don't be surprised if he ends up edging your boy with women voters at the ned of the day. Quite a turn around from 3 years ago don't ya think?
Where is the Truth?
Romney says Obama Wants to cut Medicare, buts the cuts go into the Health Care for you and I, and Jackson, even Toymann, (which I feel he does not need any his friends Help, even mine) , and the rest of Us. This is My True Love or Not.
Why do the lies go on."Romney says tax increases will not happen to the middle class". Lies, Lies. Middle class is around $43,000.
Search Google as to where you Stand, under Rowney's Plan.
Don't listen to Jackson and his uninformed dummies!
I respect his choices, but know he has not traveled to the sites he is judging over. I and an a lot of others have been to. But he want to be the Boss. Like Romney. Romney does not know all the answers. Neither does Jackson.
It is Good that Jackson has turned Peru over to another Moderator.
Sorry, Jackson, but you Need Us.
Some said Reagen's time was Great, Gingrich said he was, but check the history of Reagan and what he said?
He Said "Reagan's Time Will Never come Again."
Not the Greatest for the Working People.
Reagan let all the Nuts out the Mental Hospitals onto the streets, We still have them on Our Streets.
Don't come to San Francisco or you will be hassled by them.
They City's Chamber of Commerce does not care.
The Chamber does not come into the City to have dinner or see the shows,
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 425872]Where is the Truth?
Romney says Obama Wants to cut Medicare, buts the cuts go into the Health Care for you and I, and Jackson, even Toymann, (which I field he does not need any us friends Help, even mine) , and the rest of Us. This is My True Love or Not.
Why do the lies go on."Romney says taxes will not happen to the middle class". Lies, Lies. Middle class is $43, 000.
Search Google as to where you Stand, under Rowney's Plan.
Don't listen to Jackson and his uninformed dummies!
I respect his choices, but know he has not traveled to the sites he is judging over. I and an a lot of others have been to. But he want to be the Boss. Like Romney. Romney does not know all the answers. Neither does Jackson.
It is Good that he has turned Peru, over to one that does.
Sorry, Jackson, but you Need Us.
Some said Reagen's time was Great, Gingrich said he was, but check the history of Reagan and what he said?
He Said "Reagan's Will Never come Again."
Not the Greatest for the Working People.
Reagan let all the Nuts of the prisons onto the streets, We still have them on Our Streets.
Don't come to San Francisco or you will hassle by them.
They City of Chamber of Commerce does not care.
They do not come into the City to have dinner or see the shows, [/QUOTE]You must be either high or drunk buddy. Go sleep it off and reread in the morning. I know you are sad at how well Romney and his crew did tonight. I guess if I was you and started seeing it all slip away I'd be tipped over as well. Get a good nights rest old fella. Monger on All. Toymann
I would like to hear how you would Make this country Great, without Government Help?
Maybe you can convince your Republicans to Create Jobs on what you say?
Which would not add more to the our Deficit?
FDR asked for help from Business, and they did help to build the Golden Gate Bridge and the rest of the county Prospered. and Grew.
The country Prospered.
Why Can't WE do that Now?
What is Your Proposal?
If you or your other Republicans or indies want to Help Our Country, What is Your Proposal, maybe your can email your congressmen and tell them to get off they're dead asses and Help our brothers and sisters to get a Job.
HAPPY LABOR DAY!
THANK YOUR WORKERS FOR MAKING YOU MONEY.
I Guess that does not apply to Right To Work States, just keep the cash registers working, Cha King, Cha King. Fuck you, no day off.
Or the Labor Workers in your off shore accounts that have to work 15 -20 hours a day for your or Romney's profits.
They are Lie ing to You and Us. Wake Up.
Greed, Greed, Greed.
[QUOTE=Toymann; 425871]Glad you are starting to see the writing on the wall WT69. You are now referencing twitter as your source. IALOTFLMAO!
You really lead a goofy and disconnected existance dude. The fact you would prefer Obamanation / Pelosi / Ried to the class act you watched tonight is truely a sad statement. This baby is all over but for the crying. Predicted this long ago. It's just a matter of time till the fat lady sings. Can't wait to see my boy slice and dice Obomanation in the debates. Your boy without telepromter on-board will be quite the show. Sorry you don't get it brother but at your age, sadly you never will! Maybe you'll do better in your next life? You seem pretty confused and sour in this one. As El Alamo put it so eloquently, you aspire to send pee wee herman to the plate in the bottom of the ninth needing a huge rally to win the day. I'm good calling up babe ruth or mickey mantle when the going gets tough! Great convention with some really cool chica speakers (Ann, Condi and Martinez rocked the house). Ryan was exellent and Romney closed the deal "big time". I know what you heard tonight from Romney didn't fit with your self-fullfilled prophecy but sadly thats all about you and nothing to do with Romney. It never fails to amaze me how dems love to howl at the moon, whistle past the cemetary, in spite of what is right in front of them. Tick. Tick. Tick. It's just a matter of time now. Say Hi to Nancy for me Dude. Toymann.
Ps. Bye the way. Just watch the bounce that this convention gives Romney with women voters. Romney has already closed the gap to 10 points. Don't be surprised if he ends up edging your boy with women voters at the ned of the day. Quite a turn around from 3 years ago don't ya think?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 425872]Where is the Truth?
Romney says Obama Wants to cut Medicare, buts the cuts go into the Health Care for you and I, and Jackson, even Toymann, (which I field he does not need any us friends Help, even mine) , and the rest of Us. This is My True Love or Not, [/QUOTE]Our government can't afford to pay for the medical expenses of wealthy people like Toymann, in a system where health care is 17% of GDP. The health care system must be reformed to lower costs, via competition or whatever, and Obamacare did not solve that problem. Sorry about that Toymann, you need to pay for your own prostate exams.
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;425872]Why do the lies go on."Romney says taxes will not happen to the middle class". Lies, Lies. Middle class is $43, 000.,[/QUOTE]The lies are coming from Obama. I posted some info that came from the IRS's web site here that showed the Democrat plan to only raise taxes on those who make more than $250, 0000 (Obama) or $1, 000, 000 (Pelosi and Schumer) won't do diddly squat. The rich don't make enough money to balance the budget. If you don't cut spending, taxes MUST rise on the middle class, or the country goes bankrupt. My belief is that Romney's plan would lower taxes on the middle class and increase taxes on the wealthy. He's proposing a 20% across the board cut, and paying for it by getting rid of loopholes. The problem is that he hasn't specified the loopholes. The reason I think is because Romney expects people to lose enthusiasm for his campaign if they hear about their special loopholes being cut, be they the oil well percentage depletion allowance or investment tax credits or whatever.
This is a fiction of the Democrat party, that the middle class will get screwed by Republican tax cuts. Bush's tax cuts made the tax system more progressive. At a given level of income for all income groups, the wealthy pay a higher percentage of the taxes after the Bush cuts.
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;425872]It is Good that he has turned Peru, over to one that does.,[/QUOTE]This is cryptic. Do you mean God has turned Peru over to Humala, one of Chavez's buddies, and he's going to straighten out Peru? Like Obama was going to straighten out the USA?
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 425872]Reagan let all the Nuts of the prisons onto the streets, We still have them on Our Streets. Don't come to San Francisco or you will hassle by them.
They City of Chamber of Commerce does not care.
They do not come into the City to have dinner or see the shows, [/QUOTE]I'm behind Reagan on that. The USA incarcerates a larger percentage of its citizens than any country in the world. We stick people in jail for using drugs, for being prostitutes, and for packing lobster tails in plastic (Honduran law, enforced by the USA Justice Department, required lobster be packaged in cardboard.) If you have to put up with some drug addict on the streets of San Francisco that you'd prefer be in jail, I don't have a lot of compassion for that.
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 425872]I Guess that does not apply to Right To Work States, just keep the cash registers working, Cha King, Cha King. Fuck you, no day off.
Or the Labor Workers in your off shore accounts that have to work 15. 20 hours a day for your or Romney's profits. , [/QUOTE]So people should be forced to join unions if they want to work? I agree completely with the offshore laborers. Chinamen and Mexicans aren't real people. They're subhuman. They shouldn't have running water or electricity or more food than they need to survive. They don't need jobs. [WT69, I realize you don't think this way. But that's the effect your policy would have if implemented by developed countries. ]
The country and the western world lost the factor job to the 3nd world country. This is good for the world bad for those on the top. There is not a thing anyone can do in 4 years or 8 to change this. Giveing money to small bussiness. With a 2 out of 3 failure rate. We be better off betting on the blackjack table. Much better odds. Americans don't vote for what is best, it votes for more money gets to them. Sad but true. The factores are gone and with them the golden goose. America needs to lose our oversize home, eating out to much and earn lower saleries to mathch the rest of the world. We live way better than our dads did. And we or still not happy. The rest is just bull shit, vote like me. So I get more money.
Thanks for pointing out my bad grammar. I edited the posts.
[QUOTE=Tiny12; 425878]Our government can't afford to pay for the medical expenses of wealthy people like Toymann, in a system where health care is 17% of GDP. The health care system must be reformed to lower costs, via competition or whatever, and Obamacare did not solve that problem. Sorry about that Toymann, you need to pay for your own prostate exams.
The lies are coming from Obama. I posted some info that came from the IRS's web site here that showed the Democrat plan to only raise taxes on those who make more than $250, 0000 (Obama) or $1, 000, 000 (Pelosi and Schumer) won't do diddly squat. The rich don't make enough money to balance the budget. If you don't cut spending, taxes MUST rise on the middle class, or the country goes bankrupt. My belief is that Romney's plan would lower taxes on the middle class and increase taxes on the wealthy. He's proposing a 20% across the board cut, and paying for it by getting rid of loopholes. The problem is that he hasn't specified the loopholes. The reason I think is because Romney expects people to lose enthusiasm for his campaign in they hear about their special loopholes being cut, be they the oil well percentage depletion allowance or investment tax credits or whatever.
This is a fiction of the Democrat party, that the middle class will get screwed by Republican tax cuts. Bush's tax cuts made the tax system more progressive. At a given level of income for all income groups, the wealthy pay a higher percentage of the taxes after the Bush cuts.
This is cryptic. Do you mean God has turned Peru over to Humala, one of Chavez's buddies, and he's going to straighten out Peru? Like Obama was going to straighten out the USA?
I'm behind Reagan on that. The USA incarcerates a larger percentage of its citizens than any country in the world. We stick people in jail for using drugs, for being prostitutes, and for packing lobster tails in plastic (Honduran law, enforced by the USA Justice Department, required lobster be packaged in cardboard.) If you have to put up with some drug addict on the streets of San Francisco that you'd prefer be in jail, I don't have a lot of compassion for that.
So people should be forced to join unions if they want to work? I agree completely with the offshore laborers. Chinamen and Mexicans aren't real people. They're subhuman. They shouldn't have running water or electricity or more food than they need to survive. They don't need jobs. [WT69, I realize you don't think this way. But that's the effect your policy would have if implemented by developed countries. ][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Tiny12; 425878]Sorry about that Toymann, you need to pay for your own prostate exams.
[/QUOTE]
If this comes to pass TinyDude, can you recommend a chica specialist in BA? Have never gone there in the past BUT may have to keep an open mind (hope Exon is reading this post. LOL). LMAO. Monger on TinyDude. Toymann
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69;425874]Greed, Greed, Greed.[/QUOTE]"[i]Greed is good. Greed works.[/i]"
[indent][indent][indent]Gordon Gekko[/indent][/indent][/indent]
[QUOTE=Esten; 425866]Actually it was a guy probably in his 50's, running his own business by himself. I paid him a few hundred bucks to bring some machines to aerate, thatch and seed my lawn in the spring. The lawn is looking good, though I still have some more work to do.
What do you think was a bigger factor for this man deciding to start his own business. Tax cuts on his personal income, or consumer demand for his service?[/QUOTE]Having started my own business, I will emphatically say it was because of the personal income I could make. Including tax cuts and other factors determining total income. Not consumer demand. Demand means nothing if the reward you can achieve is too low or far outweighed by the risks and costs you incur.
There is a ton of consumer demand in Canada and Euro countries for elective surgery. But not a lot of suppliers because they are aware the potential personal income they could earn because of tax raises and crushing diminishing return on state reimbursed dollars per services rendered makes the reward for such work a losing proposition regardless of the demand.
Also, regarding prior posts you've made, you seem to disregard not only the risk the job creator made with his / her own personal capital to create that job, But that the personal capital used was already taxed at least once and frequently multiple times before I invested it into creating a business and directly creating net incremental new jobs.
Further, those like you also seem to forget that it is not just the personal capital at risk, but the soul crushing pressure and sometimes despair that real human beings now depend on you. The business owner, job creator, and income provider for your employees.
The happiest day for one of my first employees hired was about 2. 5 years into the birth of my business. She'd been with me since the start, along with a dozen others. She proudly told me she had just completed making offer and going into escrow for her first home purchase ever. In fact the first home anyone in her family had ever owned. Basically the American dream of buying that first home.
It was the worst day of my life. Outwardly happy for her but terrified that I now had people who literally depended on me to succeed not just for my own "greed" and filthy capitalist pursuit of wealth but so they could make mortgage payments.
If you've never created new jobs, can you even comprehend why I and people like me feel we deserve our tax breaks and other incentives to grow real income and productivity for this country? I don't particularly care which political party a person backs, but the day there are more takers than makers, more entitement vs risk takers, and more screaming about taking wealth from those that actually made that wealth plus took a heck of a lot of people upwards with them, is the day our country loses that special ability to constantly generate and regenerate the creativity and drive to fuel the world economy
[QUOTE=Toymann;425883]If this comes to pass TinyDude, can you recommend a chica specialist in BA? Have never gone there in the past BUT may have to keep an open mind (hope Exon is reading this post. LOL). LMAO. Monger on TinyDude. Toymann[/QUOTE]Toymann, I'm not into that either. And it's been 5 years since I last visited BA. However, once upon a time in Mexico City, I woke up from a drunken stupor in a puddle of my own puke and had a wine cork stuffed up my ass. It felt really good. I believe it was placed there by a portena, Ayelen, although it's possible I did it to myself. She has since returned to Argentina: [url]http://www.ayelenlove.com/[/url]. She's not the prettiest, but if I were blindly looking for something like that she's the first person I'd go to.
Dirty Harry's speech was awesome!
Try to watch it if you have not seen it!
Deserves an Oscar, should think about being a Stand Up Comedian!
TL
[QUOTE=Tiny12; 425913]Toymann, I'm not into that either. And it's been 5 years since I last visited BA. However, once upon a time in Mexico City, I woke up from a drunken stupor in a puddle of my own puke and had a wine cork stuffed up my ass. It felt really good. I believe it was placed there by a portena, Ayelen, although it's possible I did it to myself. She has since returned to Argentina:
[url]http://www.ayelenlove.com/[/url]
She's not the prettiest, but if I were blindly looking for something like that she's the first person I'd go to.[/QUOTE]It looks like the girl in the link has done multiple cycles of anabolic steroids to go along with an overdose of plastic surgery. Did she have a clitoris the size of a grown man's thumb?
She didn't have the body builder physique when I saw her, although she did have the collagen-implanted lips. Anyway I think the thing about anabolic steroids increasing the size of the clitoris is an old wive's tale. I tried it on my dog and it does not work.
Sic Semper tyrannis!
And all things will become what they were before!
Boot that son of a ***** out!
My specialty is PUTAS not politics but we need a new president!
TL
Good post Mpexy.
[QUOTE=Mpexy;425899]Having started my own business, I will emphatically say it was because of the personal income I could make. Including tax cuts and other factors determining total income. Not consumer demand. Demand means nothing if the reward you can achieve is too low or far outweighed by the risks and costs you incur.[/QUOTE]Of course your net personal income is the motivator. What you take in, minus expenses and taxes.
But demand is the key underlying factor. All your income comes from your customers. How many will buy your product and how much they are willing to pay. Without demand you got nothing.
Some types of businesses have a greater profit potential than others. Some are not sufficiently attractive to incentivize an entrepreneur, as the example you gave. But when it comes to personal income taxes, I don't buy the argument that a change of 5 or 10% is a major factor for most small business owners. In the example of the landscaper I hired, I can assure you that his overwhelming consideration was consumer demand, not his tax burden.
[QUOTE]Also, regarding prior posts you've made, you seem to disregard not only the risk the job creator made with his / her own personal capital to create that job, But that the personal capital used was already taxed at least once and frequently multiple times before I invested it into creating a business and directly creating net incremental new jobs.[/QUOTE]No risk, no reward. That's what they say. I'm all in favor of incentivizing entrepreneurs and businesses to grow, and create wealth and jobs. And we already have plenty of incentives and deductions available to help them. Funny how rarely you hear a business guy acknowledge this. If we need more let's talk about it. But doing so through the personal tax code just isn't the way to do it.
Take Mitt Romney for example. He made $21 Million in 2010 and paid a 14% tax rate. How many jobs did he create? By his own admission he was "unemployed". Sorry, this country has a major problem with wealthy non-job creators benefitting from low tax rates, who take cover behind the argument that tax cuts always help the economy and create jobs.
[QUOTE]Further, those like you also seem to forget that it is not just the personal capital at risk, but the soul crushing pressure and sometimes despair that real human beings now depend on you. The business owner, job creator, and income provider for your employees.
The happiest day for one of my first employees hired was about 2. 5 years into the birth of my business. She'd been with me since the start, along with a dozen others. She proudly told me she had just completed making offer and going into escrow for her first home purchase ever. In fact the first home anyone in her family had ever owned. Basically the American dream of buying that first home.
It was the worst day of my life. Outwardly happy for her but terrified that I now had people who literally depended on me to succeed not just for my own "greed" and filthy capitalist pursuit of wealth but so they could make mortgage payments.[/QUOTE]I have a lot of respect for the entrepreneur and businessman. I also have a lot of respect for doctors, teachers, policemen, firemen, scientists, etc etc. If you're looking for someone to put the businessman up on a pedestal, you're asking the wrong guy. A businessman is not the economy, they are a piece of the economy.
Free-market capitalism has brought us down a road where wealth and power increasingly accumulate at the top (wealthy individuals and large corporations). I would argue even the small businessman has been hurt by these Darwinian trends. I support incentivizing and rewarding entrepreneurs and small businesses, but not in a manner that further increases economic inequality. Do it in a way that will help the landscaper I hired, but not guys like Mitt Romney or Warren Buffett, who don't need any help.
As for the estimates of electoral college votes the candidates are likely to win, currently Obama is leading 237-206, with 95 undetermined. Of course some of you will maintain that the NY Times is a liar. [url]http://elections.nytimes.com/2012/electoral-map[/url]
[QUOTE=Esten;425931]All your income comes from your customers. How many will buy your product and how much they are willing to pay. Without demand you got nothing.[/QUOTE]It's not rocket science Jefe and your ubercapitalist know-it-alls on the site who make ever so cogent comments on economic philosophy and business practice in voices rising up from out of your fundaments!
If it is Controlled.
A Profit Limit?
Okay, If It does not Fuck the working Class!
[url]http://fuckconservatives.wordpress.com/2012/09/01/bill-maher-overtime-83112/[/url]
The Movie 1216, was Incorrect, Watch It.
What a bunch of Fucking Lies.
Are You still that Dumb?
[QUOTE=Jackson; 425884]"[i]Greed is good. Greed works. [/i]"
[indent][indent][indent]Gordon Gekko[/indent][/indent][/indent][/QUOTE]
Enjoy my wild-ass liberal buddy. In his own words. IALOTFLMAO.
[url]http://www.therightscoop.com/devastating-new-rnc-ad-weve-heard-it-all-before/[/url]
This is NOT an attack add WT69. Nothing about eating kittens or satanic rituals, tax evasion or murder. The comander and chief and his own words. You really drink the cool aid dude. Monger On WT69. Toymann