I bet it is closer than you think.
[QUOTE=Doppelganger; 426469]WT69 the fact that the 47% of folks who don't pay taxes are more likely to vote for Obama is news?
The fact that those folks receiving funds / support for the government are more likely to vote for Obama's handout bandwagon is news?
About the only thing I can see as news worthy is the fact Romney is at least honest about it.
When Team Obama says he is a president who represents ALL the people I guess they are referring to the fact he is trying to fleece the money from the 53% who pay taxes so he can give it to the 47% who don't. I guess you could call that "representing" all the folks.[/QUOTE]First of all I bet the plurality of non-income tax payers do not vote given 62% turnout in the 2008 election. Second senior citizens more likely to have social security as their sole income and they vote in higher numbers than the rest of us. Senior citizens are more likely to vote for Romney than Obama. It might even be worth a proposition bet that Romney carries the 47% if someone gave big enough odds. People are so adamant about this issue you might be able to sucker someone by saying Obama will carry the 47% by less than 10% and give you 10 to 1 odds. I don't know the outcome but I would like to see the stats on this one. Maybe Sydney could structure a sure proposition bet winner.
The problem with Romney's comments
It's not that he pointed out a large number of people pay no income tax and receive something from the government. It's what he said about those people.
[QUOTE]“There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them. Who believe they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it. It's an entitlement and the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what. And the president starts off with 48, 49 … he starts off with a huge number. These are people who pay no income tax. Forty-seven percent of Americans pay no income tax.”[/QUOTE]Romney is just wrong that all these people will vote for Obama. A small majority of them might. But a large number will vote Republican. Check WT's picture, several of the states with the lowest incomes are red states. In fact, almost half of Romney's electoral college votes will come from these low-income states.
Romney is also wrong that all these people consider themselves "victims" and expect free stuff. The vast majority of those people are hard working people who pay federal payroll taxes (and other state and local levies) or are senior citizens receiving Social Security and Medicare.
Romney must know these things, so what's he up to? He's promoting an idea that almost half the country is a "taker class" and they all support Obama. This feeds his base, who gobble it up and proclaim it true without question. Anyone who says Romney's statement was factual and accurate is not just drinking the kool-aid, but quaffing it.
Romney should ask himself a few questions.
What does the low-income Republican think of Romney's comment that he will vote for Obama no matter what? That he doesn't want to take responsibility for his life? That Republican would probably be insulted and think Romney doesn't know what he's talking about. That he's out of touch.
What does the low-income Senior think of Romney's comment that she will vote for Obama no matter what? That she doesn't want to take responsibility for her life? That Senior would probably be insulted and think Romney doesn't know what he's talking about. That he's out of touch.
Romney's comments are certain to alienate some voters, the only question is how many.
What Do You Know About 2016?
What do you Boys know about 2016, the movie about Obama, and what do you think about it?
Just watched the piece on the Glen Beck show about the movie.
Interesting facts about Obama's Agenda!
TL.
Possible Agenda, has a Poker Face and keeps his cards close.
47% non-income tax payers is the wrong statistic to Romney's view
Romney should have just said the 47% who are Obama's supporters view themselves as victims. Clearly government workers, teachers and union workers pay income tax yet I think Romney would view them as syncophants. They are the one's who Romney thinks view themselves as victims of society. It is really Ayn Rand's view of the world that it is composed of givers and takers that he was trying to describe. It is just not same subset of the population that pay no income tax. Many Romney supporters would regard paying no income tax as a positive not a negative. Most of us try to minimize the income taxes we pay. In the Randian sense. 47% is close to being accurate I would think.
It does point out the difficulty Republicans have in cutting government. Many of their supporters use government benefits rightfully to their own advantage.
It's ok to be different, but we need to work together.
Both sides have shown that they will slant everything to their advantage, and AP forum is blindly follow the rhetoric. Can we continue to pretend that there is truthfulness in politics? Once in power, it is to the death to stay in power. Assad and Syria is the prime example following Khaddafi in Libya. To do the same, politics in Thailand resemble circus acts with the USA not too far behind.
But what is funny is that with the changes in governments, is that in reality, nothing really changes. The rich & powerful will remain rich & powerful. They will adjust to the new leadership and play their power game. And the poor & disenfranchised will contine their cycle of poverty. The US will remain the country of opportunity for the average citizen because of several factors. It is a young country, it's lands are vast and rich, it's population is small and it's people because of continued immigration, hard working, versatile and innovative. And so, democracy and capitalism was able thrive. It does not do as well elsewhere. And now, somehow, we have hit the wall. The reasons are many and myraid. I welcome some discussion on this.
People can talk in big generous rhetoric, but we will never vote against our own little selfish & self-indulgent lifestyles. We managed to achieved some success and we all think we are such great controllers of our own destiny. Let the air flight develop some serious problem, and all the atheists will turn into believers in a split second. It's that hilarious. And in America, things are quite hilarious right now. But as funny as it is, I find myself not laughing.
Fallout from Romney's comments
60% Income less than $50,000
25% Senior Citizens
15% Unemployed
That's the breakdown of the 47%. Actually there's a few thousand millionaires in there too, that amazingly pay no income tax. But taking these numbers, it is clearly ludicrous to say a huge % of the country prefers a handout to personal responsibility. Some Republicans get it.
Arizona Senator Jon Kyl : [i] "I think if he were to recharacterize what he thinks about the vote he's going to get, he would appreciate that a lot of the folks that are currently receiving some benefit from the government are very likely to vote for him." [/i]
Connecticut Senate candidate Linda McMahon: [i] "I disagree with Governor Romney's insinuation that 47% of Americans believe they are victims who must depend on the government for their care. I know that the vast majority of those who rely on government are not in that situation because they want to be."[/i]
Massachusetts Senator Scott Brown: [i] "That's not the way I view the world. As someone who grew up in tough circumstances, I know that being on public assistance is not a spot that anyone wants to be in."[/i]
Nevada Senator Dean Heller: [i] "I just don't view the world the same way he does."[/i]
New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez: [i] "We have a lot of people that are at the poverty level in New Mexico, but they count just as much as anybody else. There is a net that does allow them to be caught and taken care of, whether it be through medical services, whether it be food services, whether it be with funding for apartments, for housing."[/i]
[QUOTE=Toymann;426370]Ps. You so underestimate Americans dude. Shame. Shame. Shame.[/QUOTE]It has become very clear; the people who underestimate Americans are Mitt Romney and those who agree with him.
As usual you just don't get it SnakeBoy!
[QUOTE=SnakeOilSales;426530]If only your comparison was accurate; it is true, Barack Obama probably isn't much better than Pee Wee Herman, however, Mitt Romney is certainly no Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady, which is the reason why Obama is leading in all polls and is the clear favorite to win the election in seven weeks. It is amazing how the Republicans can continue to put up terrible, borderline unelectable candidates for two consecutive election cycles; how could they, in their right minds, nominate a MORMON Wall Street Shark worth more than $250 million who was born with a platinum plated and diamond encrusted spoon in his mouth- during a period of economic turmoil largely caused by out of touch Wall Street Sharks just like Romney? How can anybody in Middle America even begin to relate to this guy when he is caught on video trashing the 47% of the electorate who receive some form of government benefits and pays just 13% of his yearly millions in taxes? The republicans should have nominated Chris Christie or some other ostensibly middle class politician who the undecided electorate in Middle America can actually relate to.[/QUOTE]In spite of your fantasy that the election is a prom queen contest, you again, as always miss the point. The 6% that will decide this election want someone who has a track record of getting the job done! Period! End of story! All polls of independents have been favouring Romney from the get go. Factor in the battleground states are mostly in the midwest (Florida is already in the bag dude) , and a Romney landslide is all but a forgone conclusion. It's not a popularity contest dumbo, america needs a closer and Obomanation has shown he is anything BUT! Keep howling at the moon. I am sure after the election you will crawl under your rock and never be heard from again on this board. It was just 20 months ago that the country voted for the greatest liberal slaughter in history. What makes you think anything has changed! It never fails to amaze me how you dudes like you and esten fail understand even the basics of small town america. Luckily most americans don't live in huge cities (at least not yet) , and the country remains a center right mosiac. Keep whistling past the cemetary SnakeBoy. Happy Mongering All. Toymann
Our Vets have 35% unemployment
So what did the GOP do to Help Them?
[url]http://takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/19/g-o-p-blocks-veteran-jobs-bill/[/url]
Why are you howling at the moon WT69?
[QUOTE=WorldTravel69; 426534]So what did the GOP do to Help Them?
[url]http://takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/19/g-o-p-blocks-veteran-jobs-bill/[/url][/QUOTE]There is NO money to pay for this dude. You just don't get it, do you? It's just a political play by senate liberals to appear like they are doing something. Why aren't you ranting about your liberal buddies in the senate looking at a budget for the country. There is one on the table but Reid and his ilk act like it doesn't exist. Where is your rage about this. This is such a two way street. You so don't get it dude. Monger on. Toymann.
Ps. Is this the same US military that you bad mouthed after they came back from Vietnam. Oh how you have changed your tune!
The new Ant and the Grasshopper Story
[u][b]The ANT and the GRASSHOPPER[/b][/u]
This one is a little different ....
Two Different Versions ...
Two Different Morals
[u][b]OLD VERSION[/b][/u]
The ant works hard in the withering heat all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.
The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.
Come winter, the ant is warm and well fed.
The grasshopper has no food or shelter, so he dies out in the cold.
[u][b]MORAL of the OLD STORY:[/b][/u]
Be responsible for yourself!
[u][b]MODERN VERSION[/b][/u]
The ant works hard in the withering heat and the rain all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.
The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.
Come winter, the shivering grasshopper calls a press conference and demands to know why the ant should be allowed to be warm and well fed while he is cold and starving.
CBS, NBC, PBS, CNN, and ABC show up to provide pictures of the shivering grasshopper next to a video of the ant in his comfortable home with a table filled with food.
America is stunned by the sharp contrast.
How can this be, that in a country of such wealth, this poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer so?
Kermit the Frog appears on Oprah with the grasshopper and everybody cries when they sing, 'It's Not Easy Being Green...'
ACORN stages a demonstration in front of the ant's house where the news stations film the SEIU group singing 'We shall overcome'.
Then Rev. Jeremiah Wright has the group kneel down to pray for the grasshopper's sake, while he damns the ants.
President Obama condemns the ant and blames President Bush 43, President Bush 41, President Reagan, Christopher Columbus, and the Pope for the grasshopper's plight..
Nancy Pelosi & Harry Reid exclaim in an interview with Larry King that the ant has gotten rich off the back of the grasshopper, and both call for an immediate tax hike on the ant to make him pay his fair share.
Finally, the EEOC drafts the Economic Equity & Anti-Grasshopper Act retroactive to the beginning of the summer.
The ant is fined for failing to hire a proportionate number of green bugs and, having nothing left to pay his retroactive taxes, his home is confiscated by the Government Green Czar and given to the grasshopper.
The story ends as we see the grasshopper and his free-loading friends finishing up the last bits of the ant's food while the government house he is in, which, as you recall, just happens to be the ant's old house, crumbles around them because the grasshopper doesn't maintain it.
The ant has disappeared in the snow, never to be seen again. The grasshopper is found dead in a drug related incident, and the house, now abandoned, is taken over by a gang of spiders who terrorize the ramshackled but once prosperous and peaceful, neighborhood.
The entire Nation collapses bringing the rest of the free world with it.
[u][b]MORAL of the STORY:[/b][/u]
Be careful how you vote in 2012.
I've sent this to you because I believe that you are an ant not a grasshopper!
Make sure that you pass this on to other ants.
Don't bother sending it on to any grasshoppers because they wouldn't understand it, anyway.
Can not grasp the concept
WT69, Esten, SOS and all the other liberals who just can not grasp the concept of "cutting entitlement spending'.
For liberals a "cut" in entitlement spending means you stop the entitlement program from growing any further not actually reduce the amount currently being spent.
This falls in line with liberal's idea that if Bush tax rates are not continued it represents a 'tax cut for the rich'. The actual 'cuts' took place years ago and the continuation of the CURRENT RATE does not represent another 'tax cut for the rich' as these are the prevailing current rates, no body's taxes went up or down. But still liberals call this a TAX CUT.
When we are borrowing 40 cents of every Federal dollar spent, we have a SPENDING PROBLEM. Entitlements such as Medicaid, Welfare and the host of other Federal handout programs must CUT BACK.
ANT's UNITE AND OVER THROW THE GRASSHOPPER OBAMA
NO, NO, NO, NO! It's much worse than that.
[QUOTE=Doppelganger;426574]For liberals a "cut" in entitlement spending means you stop the entitlement program from growing any further not actually reduce the amount currently being spent.[/QUOTE]A cut almost always means the entitlement program continues to grow. In the case of some programs, like Medicare, it continues to grow faster than per capita GDP. But since it was supposed to grow, say, 6% per year before the change but only 5% after, it's a cut.
Need info on grasshoppers
How many grasshoppers are there ? (ie. people who could work, but choose to be lazy, and expect a handout)
What are their political affiliations ?
Aesop fables and broad dismissals of 47% of the population, this is how Republicans perpetuate the myth that the country is full of irresponsible freeloaders who are all aligned with one political party. It would be nice if they could support their argument with some facts, but that would be asking too much. Perhaps because they are lazy, or more likely, the facts just don't back them up.
I suspect they would prefer to read their fables, drink some hot chocolate, and then go beddy bye.
