Apartment buying experiences

[Hunt99]

One guy I know who does this stuff for a living gave me a tip on what he does, perhaps Aleman might utilize it.

If something is overpriced, offer the correct price that you would pay, even if you think the seller would be "insulted." The offer in always cash, settlement in 14 days. Most of the time the offers are rejected, once in a while, less than 5% of the time, his offer sparks a negotiation that results in a sale at a much reduced price. But I think you get the idea.

At least that's what he does in the US. I guess the strategy ought to work in Argentina, as it is not country-specific.

[El Aleman]

Yesterday (Monday) I have seen some more. This time, some more appealing than on Friday. I start getting a feeling about price and value. However, there are apartments on the market that are just plain overpriced.

I saw one, for example, that has a good location, good room layout, but is completely run down. Renovatoin does not mean new paint, it means go down to the raw bricks of the wall, new plaster, everything. And, of course, new bathroom, new kitchen, new heating, new windows, etc.

I own a beautiful 1895 vintage building in Europe, and did the restauration there. I know about these things. The realtor meant, that with U$S 15000 I would see a lot, I mentally just double this sum.

Another one, absolutely prime location (corner of Libertad / Libertador) Maybe the best address one can get in this city. But small, rear side (5 m in front of the living room window is the big white wall of the neighbouring building) $ 2000 per square meter. Way too much, despite the location.

Going to see the next 2 in a few minutes.

El Alemán

[El Aleman]

First, thanks for the encouragement that came through posts and pm's. I appreciate it.

Palermo is in my search pattern, however not the area way out at the hippodromo. The limit is more or less a 10 min / 10 peso cab ride from the center. And, at this time, I am not looking into new construction.

The "Argentinean representative" issue has been resolved (thanks, Saint! You can buy property as a foreigner, you just need an Argentinean citizen / company thereafter who will take responsibility for paying your property taxes. This service can be provided by a good property management company, in my case it is easy, I own an Argentinean S. R. L. (=LLC) who could do this.

I saw my Lawyer a couple of days ago, and went through the whole buying process with him. He more or less confirmed everything I read on the apartmentsba web site, with a few addendums concerning his own services. Whoever is interested in buying property down here, Saint's web side is mandatory reading.

El Alemán

[Hunt99]

Aleman, good luck to you on this project. A year ago I spent a couple of days scouting out new construction in Puerto Madero, and eventually came to the decision that renting was a better value than buying, at least for the prices I saw.

You have limited your geographic search - have you thought of looking in Palermo? Many of the first-class condominiums that are in the Hippodromo / Libertador area are said to be much more reasonably priced than Recoleta real estate. I think the neighborhoods out that way are very nice, as well.

[Mojokpr]

el Aleman,

Thanks for starting this thread and letting us know about your experience, it is relevant to some of us and will be very helpfull.

Good luck with your purchase, it sounds like something fun if not also a good investment.

[Thomaso276]

As I have been telling alot of folks. I lived in two apartments in Recoleta -(Quintana 500 block and Callao 1400 block) for the past three years. I now live downtown on San Martin and Marcelo T.

Downtown is much quieter! At night and on weekends it is very serene. No delivery mopeds, no sirens from emergency vehicles, no car alarms going off all night. Less homeless people hanging around (because the money is walking around residential areas) less garbage in the streets after the nightly cartoneros (offices produce paper trash, not as much household trash)

There are some revelers at night but the physical layout of my apartment muffles the street conversations to a minimum whisper. Groups of singing drunks was something I dealt with in my other apartments. As well, my building is professional with 7 of 10 apartments used as offices so neighbor noise is almost zilch after 7pm. There is one neighbor in a back building who plays music on weekends that reasonates up the quad. I just close my window, I may talk to them or the building manager next week but it is not terrible.

[Thomaso276]

Critical info on this site: thanks to Saint.

http://www.apartmentsba.com/Consulti...ng_Process_84/

[MCSE]

I've published a research made in 2003 on my website and I'm thinking about publishing another one made in 2005. Somehow this may help since there are prices and conditions on it. My advise for you guys looking for apartments it's to buy the newspaper and get to the 'guardias' from 3PM to 6PM on saturdays. It's the only way it works.

[El Aleman]

I have seen my lawyer on Thursday, between other things to talk about my intended apartment buy. He mentioned nothing concerning this law. I wil, however, ask him explicitely.

El Alemán

[El Aleman]

Yesterday, Friday May 12, I did my first Apartment visiting tour. 2 in Avda. Santa Fé, 2 more in Palermo a bit off this street, and one closer to Recoleta, Guterrez near Las Heras. I was met at the first address by Adriana, a lady who does freelance work for ApartmentsBA and who was to be my guide for the afternoon.

Nothing that shouted "Buy Me, Buy Me" so loud that I could not resist. Some with really shitty layout, small rooms, lot of space wasted in hallways etc. Well, if one wants to squeeze a family of 5 plus maid into 80 m² the small rooms are ok, but I want something more spacious.

One observation: the spec sheets the realtors give you nearly never have a floor plan. In Germany, this is the first you get, and I consider it extremely helpful. You can sort out immediately the silly layouts. Pictures don't help, especially as they mainly show the present owner's taste in furniture which is usually different from mine.

Also, it was good practice to my Spanish. Adriana exposed me to a constant 3 hour stream of castellano talking, about apartments and all other possible topics. I was still recovering from a night with 3 hours of sleep.

Went home for a siesta, more apartments to see on Sunday.

El Alemán

[JengisKhan]

I am also very interested in this topic, being in the market myself. I would appreciate any advice that people who have bought already or that know something about the market could offer. I would suspect that Saint probably knows as much as anyone on this topic, but I'm not interested in paying for his advice. Perhaps as a collective group we might be able to help not only ourselves but others who are considering a property investment here.

Danke for starting the thread, Señor Aleman.

[El Aleman]

I arrived on Saturday, May 6, and had hired the most beautiful remis driver of the world for an extended reconaissance tour through the neigbourhoods I was interested in on Sunday.

Ana showed me around, commented on the places we went, all in all a good experience. However, nothing beats your own feet when trying to discover a city. I had known some areas where she took me before, (one couple of blocks from an extended walk on Saturday afternoon) and you see much more when not in a car.

Lots of for sale signs!

The day ended (has nothing to do with real estate) very pleasantly in the company of an old favorita.

The next day, Monday, I met with Saint. We talked a bit about the general situation, and I made my requirements a bit more precise than it has been before by email. We agreed to set up a tour to see some apartments near the end of the week.

Monday afternoon until Wednesday night I was out of town.

El Alemán

[El Aleman]

Hi everybody,

I started this thread to share some experiences I am going to make during the process of buying an Apartment in Buenos Aires. It will be (from my side) a loose collection of observations, caveats, funny things, whatever comes around. Hopefully with some sort of happy end.

What I don't want is 2 things:

- starting a flame war on the question if buying property here is the best possible investment on the planet or outright loco. This subject has bees discussed ad nauseam, and I know all the pro's and con's. The truth, as usual is somewhere in the middle, and I made a decision based on the information I got.

- starting a flame war if it is a good idea to avail oneself of the services of apartmentsba aka Saint. I also know the pro's and con's of that, and the baseline came out in a discussion with Jackson a few days ago, where he said he would not need such a service, he could take care of things himself - and I countered, that for him, "things would be away 5 minutes and a A$R 5 cab ride, while for me it's a U$S 1500 plane ticket. We agreed that every business activity involves expenses in some ways, and this may just be one of them.

So, please refrain from calling me any names because of these 2 items - any other comments are more than welcome.

What am I looking for?

I want an apartment for 2 purposes: use it myself while I am in Buenos Aires (which is about twice a year, 2 weeks each time) have it used by some friends / business partners, and rent it out the rest of the time. Sizewise, I look for about 70 to 80 square meters, 2 bedrooms, living / dining room, if possible 2 bathrooms. Location, I concentrate on a ring shaped area around Recoleta, limited on the south by 9 de Julio, west by Córdoba, northeast Juan B. Justo. That is large parts of Barrios Norte, Palermo and Recoleta. And I want a high floor, with a lot of light and away from the street noise.

Neither real estate nor investing in Argentina is new for me - I own residential and commercial property in Europe, and I have been doing business in Argentina for a couple of years, including a substantial investment. It is, however, my first involvement with residential real estate in this country.

I made the decision some time in February or March this year, after doing some figures and seeing that a reasonable amount of $$$ was available, and remembering that walking in Bs. As. I sometimes spent more time staring up at the "for sale" signs than watching the beauties on the street. I retained Apartmentsba for their basic consulting package (which at the beginning consists mainly of them emailing you a couple of offers per week that they filtered out of the tons of ads in the local papers and realtor's offers, and think might match your profile.

And I decided to dedicate a fair amount of time during this visit to my search.

El Alemán