Is crime increasing in BA?

[MCSE]

Not sure if this is the right place to post it, but 911 is now the police and emergencies number in BA. Police # used to be 101, and for a period both numbers are working.

[Bacchus9]

Apparently residents of Belgrano would vote YES in this poll.

Per the Buenos Aires Herald today residents of Belgrano are leafleting the neighborhood for a rally Thursday at 19hs to demand increased security and justice because the organizers of the protest claim there's "a rampant crime wave of which they say the shooting spree was only the latest example". I think there was a woman gunned dead in her car a couple of weeks ago when an alledged 2 or 3 stalled car set up was used to try to kidnap a businesswoman from a golf course concession carrying a lot of cash to the bank. Couldn't make her stop so they just blasted her through the windshield.

[Dickhead]

OK. I got an alibi. I have a train ticket from V. Lopez stamped at 4:32 and a Subte ticket stamped in Juramento at 5:08 and I swear officer I went right from there to a qualified professional whorehouse at Santa Fe 3373 where I fucked a fat chick "named" Carolina. Also I have a cash receipt from the Norte across the street showing I bought a 16 oz can of Brahma at 6:12.

Shit. Wait a minute. That puts me in Belgrano right at 5 PM. I was probably walking down Juramento at that very moment. Should have bought a beer to establish a more solid alibi but I don't like to drink before I go to a whorehouse.

[Thomaso276]

Okay, you are cleared. Time of incident; 5pm on July 6.

Photo lineups are comonly used and many detectives always place the suspect in the same numbered slot (from 1 to 6) That way when they go to court months or years later they can always say the witness picked out suspect number 5 (or 4 or 3 etc. Without any doubt.

Witness only convictions are always the weakest cases and you would be surprised how many "twins" you have out there. There is a guy in my gym who looks like my older brother, height, weight, hair, glasses, build all the same. He could easily be mistaken for the same person especially if the contact was for less than a minute.

One other thing, detectives are always looking for the "changed story" response. Once they find inconsistencies it makes them more suspicious as lies tend to unravel.

[Dickhead]

Two days ago I was with a QPP until around 2:30 PM from 10 PM the previous evening and I can prove my whereabouts by ATM withdrawal. Yesterday I was with a QPP and can prove my whereabouts by ATM withdrawal. Another thing is I save all my Carrefour receipts because otherwise I might lose 89 centavos on bottle deposits. I bet I could reconstruct all the way back to my trip to Uruguay on Wednesday except for Thursday I went to a privado and they only make you check in at night. I got the train, subte, and bus tickets plus receipts for beers I bought afterwards. In fact I bet I was at the gym when that incident occurred and they do magnetic card swipes. Of course they wouldn't know if I lent my card to someone else although at my previous gym they sure as hell would have.

You could give me a paraffin test. I haven't fired a gun in 37 years. But using the buses to commit crimes here is tempting. Even if a witness saw me get on the 39 bus in the 2500 block of Santa Fe at 2:16 PM, the 39 bus goes by there about every 10 seconds. It'd be a while before you could even narrow down the driver.

When I was 17 years old I spent 17 days in county lockup, charged with robbing a liquor store. The cops in my home town knew I was a skid but also knew I'd never been known to do anything violent or carry a weapon, but the liquor store owner picked out my picture and then positively ID'ed me in a line up. The bond was $10,000 and this was 1974. The detective who ran me in, who knew me, promised to keep investigating. He told me he didn't think I did it but with the ID and my record he had no choice but to hold me. There had been a series of robberies but I only got charged with the last one. I was still recovering my memory from a severe concussion and skull fracture a few months earlier and plus I stayed pretty baked and by the time they interviewed me I really had no idea where the hell I'd been a couple of days earlier.

Well, the dude finally hit another liquor store (he'd been hitting about one every couple of weeks) and got caught red-handed. It was unbelievable how much he looked like me. He was four years older and three inches shorter, and stockier, but in the face, wow. I guess Thomaso can confirm that robbery victims often ID the perp as being bigger than they really are.

Anyway ever since then I've been cognizant of remembering where the hell I've been and how I could maybe prove it, and saving things like ATM receipts and bus or train tickets for at least a month or so. Back in the US that was one reason why I used credit cards for even the smallest purchases. I don't do that here cuz they bang me 3% but I sure do save receipts. I keep the bus, train, and Subte receipts for about two months and ditto with any grocery receipts, laundry tickets, etc. Also it's another good reason to make a little small talk any time you go into a store. I always say "hola" to the driver when I get on the bus and "gracias" when I get off. You never know; they might remember a red headed gringo.

True story. No hard feelings and it helped me turn myself around especially since the detective (Ron Malone was his name and he would bust you for two loose seeds in your ashtray but he did me square this time) came and talked to me three or four times while I was in the clink to let me know he was still looking for alternative perps. Plus I learned how to split a match four ways and how to make pruno. I also learned some shit that is better forgotten like how to use masking tape so you can break a window without making any noise.

Anybody still has the newspaper, what time did that happen on Thursday? Just for laughs I'd like to see what kind of alibi I would have.

[Thomaso276]

Just found this on the web:

July 07, 2006

Man attacks NY subway passengers with power saw.

New York City police are searching for a suspect after he went on a rampage Thursday with two cordless power saws he took off a subway station workbench. He swung the saws at riders, slicing open a man's chest before fleeing the scene.

With a saw in each hand, the man swung at one rider missed. Moments later, he cut into the man's chest at a turnstile before running out of the station, still carrying the saw, which were later found in a garbage can.

The 64-year-old victim was hospitalized in critical but stable condition. Police are searching for the suspect, described as a thin man in his 30s, who was carrying a teddy bear and had earrings in both ears.

Police were also reviewing a security camera videotape for evidence.

F******* power saws! How the hell did he disappear? I bet he didn't drop the teddy bear.

[Thomaso276]

I read this morning that witnesses produced two distinctly different IDENTAKIT drawings of the suspect, thereby negating their value. Or so the paper said, this may be a story to keep the guy from disappearing while they search. Cops are not going to spill all to the papers. The guy just blended in with all the panic and hopped on a bus. If you ever take a bus here note how attentive the drivers and passengers are (not) I am sure they are all being interviewed. What if the guy got off 6 blocks away, doubled back and got on another bus for San Telmo? In the states white T -shirt and blue jeans was the norm for clothing, what would it be here? Black T shirt and black slacks? Pretty non-descript.

Believe me, witnesses always miss many features of suspects. Defense lawyers love to use conflicting statements from witnesses to get their clients off. Just think of the movie, My Cousin Vinny. On the other hand if there had been just one witness in the OJ case who put him near the scene or in the area he might have been convicted (might have, who knows with that jury) It is a combination of fear, panic, adrenilin rush (which produces tunnel vision) and short term memory issues. Tough to look at a suspect and make notes when you are ducking behind a trash can. Clothing doesn't mean much once you lose sight of suspect because clothing change is a basic element for these idiots. Who knows how much planning he put into this? He might have waited till the bus was a couple of blocks away and been close enuff to the stop, having scouted out the neighborhood before.

Best evidence is physical and a snitch. They are searching security cameras throughout the area for some leads. As well, police never release all the details and may have other leads. Probably checking hospitals for ex-pysche patients with tendency for violence. I am not sure about Dr.- patient disclosures here but would imagine they could get info. Looking into ex-military and police with problems.

I read where the gun was a 380, pretty common. I imagine alot of legitimate and underground gun dealers are getting squeezed and burglary reports are being scoured to try and ID the gun.

In my hometown recently someone killed three streetwalkers. He has not been caught for months. Chances are he got on a bus and left town. Same thing could happen with this nut. If this shooter in Belgrano is local he will probably be caught. Someone will be telling cops about a crazy neighbor or they may trace the gun to him. If he started travelling it makes it more difficult.

I'd be looking for ex-postal employees! DH where were you two days ago?

Lochdhu, you probably have seen it all, glad to see someone understands that these thugs are always looking for an edge. I had some experience with chemical mace for mobile field force issues. Good stuff.

[El Perro]

Here's a question for Thomaso about the lone gunman incident in Belgrano about 4 days ago. How does a guy open fire on on several people in broad daylight, is described by bystanders by his attire, jumps on a fucking bus, makes his "getaway", and remains at large days afterwards? Wouldn't interviews conducted with people on the bus turn up this guy? Is this shitty police work? Is this a sleep walking public? Luck?

[Crash Helmet]

Another carrier, believe it or not, sprayed a pet bird that was in a cage on a porch. He said it startled him and he didn't know what he was spraying at until it was too late.

A caged bird? Now that's funny! And if you were a postman you should read a book written by Charles Bukowski called, "Post Office."

[Dickhead]

I carried mail for the USPS for 8 years and sprayed maybe five or six dogs during that time and found the effectiveness to be 100% in that the said dogs at least went away. One owner complained because I sprayed her dog (days) after it had bitten me and was chained in the yard and was no threat to me. Yeah, well, payback's a motherfucker. I got a warning but nothing in my jacket. My story was that I couldn't tell how long the chain was when the dog started coming at me.

We had a carrier by the name of Sam Erwin. He's dead now so I see no harm in using his name. He was a drunk. We used to call him "Sunset Sam" because he would never make it back on time, being that he was drinking in the Elks' Club. Several times supervisors went to try to drag him out of there, only to be denied admittance since they were not members of the club.

Well, one day Sam, who was sixty years old and skinny as hell and not in good health, sprayed a dog. Sam's route consisted entirely of run-down mobile home parks off of Colfax Ave in east Denver. The guy got pissed and threatened Sam in some way so Sam sprayed him real good. They both got arrested and Sam got suspended. Eventually the guy was found guilty of assault and Sam not guilty of assault and battery, and Sam got the suspension overturned so it amounted to a paid vacation without using vacation time.

Another guy I knew sprayed a dog into the wind and ended up getting real sick and missing a few days' work. Another carrier sprayed a dog, that was inside the house, through the mail slot because he was sick of it barking at him. That suspension stuck. Another carrier, believe it or not, sprayed a pet bird that was in a cage on a porch. He said it startled him and he didn't know what he was spraying at until it was too late. Yeah, right. He should have gotten fired but all he got was a letter of warning and some corrective training on how and when to use the spray.

Another thing the spray does, at least the "Halt" brand we used, is it marks the sprayee with a dye so they can be readily identified.

I did hear of numerous instances where the spray was ineffective on dogs, including on one stray we called "Old Yeller" because he had so much of that fucking yellow dye all over his face all the time.

One time I kicked a real fat dachshund that had bitten my pants leg and wouldn't let go, and I kicked it a little too hard in the belly and it died. I got a letter of warning but it got overturned in arbitration.

Ah, the good old days.

[Crash Helmet]

As Dickhead said, using pepper spay in the wind is dicey.

You could use it on a windy day, though you'd have to move in a postion where the wind is blowing in the face of your adversary. Would you have the presence of mind to do that in a situation where your adrenaline is running at hyper speed?

I used it one time in downtown Sacramento. A guy was acting a little hostile towards me and clearly made it known that he was going to escalate the situation. I calmly pulled out the little can of spray and sprayed it in his face. I don't know, he was about five or six feet away from me. This all happened ten years ago.

It brought him to his knees. He dropped to the ground like he'd been hit over the head by a bag of bricks.

I turned around and walked away without saying a word. I looked back several times and he was still on his knees rubbing the hell out of his eyes. I walked to my car, got in it, and drove back to the area of confrontation to see what had transpired. By that time, five minutes or so had passed. He was still in the same spot, though now standing and a bit dazed. He was diligently rubbing his eyeballs with both hands, straining to regain his normal vision. That was the first and only time I ever used pepper spray on a person and it had done exactly what it was supposed to do.

You people should be damn glad it's legal to carry pepper spray in Argentina unlike it is in Tijuana, a city right near where I live in San Diego. If I were you guys I'd research the stun gun matter.

Anyone else here ever use pepper spray on a person in a real life situation?

[Lochdhu]

I worked in a state correctional facility for some time. And having endured many riots, and having to use pepper spray all the time, we came across something odd, some of the mexicans had become resistant to its effects, we later find out, the Hispanic Population was intentionally putting the juice from canned Jalapenos in there eyes on a regular basis getting acclamated to the effects of the pepper spray. And were still able to put up a good fight, while the other races were laided out. But damm, the Chemical Mace is some nasty shit. Got caught up in a riot once and one of the stupid turnkeys shot a round off in the building, and laid us all out!

[Thomaso276]

Pepper spray comes in two varieties: water based and alcohol based. When first introduced to law enforcement the alcohol based Oleoresin Capiscum (commonly called OC) was the only one available at 5 and 10% mix. The best delivery was always as a fine mist, spraying out in a cone pattern, the alcohol base allowed the particles to stick to the skin and menbranes. (I used to joke and call it the "cone of silence" from the old Get Smart show) The finer the mist the more effective the OC was in delivering minute particles to the eyes, nose and mouth which inflamed the mucus menbranes and shut down a persons ability to properly function. Believe me, the alcohol mist is the best and yes some blow back occurred. However, the majority of the particles are delivered to the subject where the can is aimed. Cannisters were designed for the finger to fit under a trigger cap which positioned the spray away from the holder. It was pretty hard to point it the worng way. These little keychain one may not have that.

Sometime thereafter the stun guns were introduced to law enforcement and a funny thing happened. About 5% of the population is resistant to the effects of OC and being drunk helps stave off the effects. I personally witnessed some folks act as if they were being sprayed with a water pistol - no effect! Soooooo, one day in a city a cop sprays a subject with alcohol based OC and it has no effect, the next cop used a stun gun which delivers a powerful electric shock (one of the best defensive weapons ever invented - 100% effective) and presto - instant fire was created from the alcohol based OC on the subject. Nice lawsuit. A lot of law enforcement agencies were in a panic. The manufacturers of OC come up with a water based OC at 5% mix. Water based is not flameable.

The water based OC shoots a stream. You would think the stream is more effective but it is not. It is not worthless but the best effect is from the fine mist cone delivery. As well, the bad guys started training to defend against OC (bad guys in prison have training every day on how to defeat police tactics) and discovered that pulling down a ballcap just before contact would deflect a majority of the stream and prevent the particles from fully impacting with mucus membranes in the eyes, nose and mouth.

OC impacts take a few seconds for effect and remember some people are immune. The subjects' mucus membranes become swollen and their eyes burn. They also get what is known as elephant snot because the nose really blows up and goes wild with snot. The effect lasts about 20 minutes, flushing water does not really help with the alcohol base (remember it sticks)

If you want to know what it is like spray some on a pole or a tree and sniff around. It will clear your clogged nose real quick.

PS: OC also works on dogs but only makes them sneeze.

[Rock Harders]

Mongers-

Pepper spray is legal in Argentina and is readily available at stores on Corrientes that sell "arms". However, misuse of pepper spray is illegal just as it is the the EEUU. I know several American females who carry and have used pepper spray against potential assailants here in Buenos Aires. As previously mentioned, pepper spray can be tricky to use because most versions only spray in a static cloud fashion, meaning it is easy to get pepper spray on your own hands / face / skin, especially if there is wind blowing toward you. The better pepper sprays are adjustable and can also shoot in a single, more accurate high powered stream, although more practice would be required to use it effectively for obvious reasons.

Since I first arrived here a year and a half ago I have not noticed any increase in crime in the city. To be honest, I fear the ridiculously corrupt, professional extortionist police forces more than any punk street criminal or crooked cab driver. Both are criminals and try to steal your money, the only difference is that the PFA use the threat of imprisonment as their vehicle to robbing you rather than traditonal criminal methods.

Suerte,

Dirk Diggler

[Lunico]

Does the pepper spray work on poultry? Cause I know no restaurant carries it.