American Politics during the Obama Presidency

[Esten]

Once upon a time, there was a man named "D" who lived in a rainy town. D walked to work each day, and sometimes he got wet when he forgot his umbrella. One rainy day, a stranger approached D as he was walking to work.

"Dear Sir", said the stranger. "I notice you don't have an umbrella, and you're getting wet from the rain. I am walking down this street for the next 5 blocks. Would you like to walk under my umbrella ?" What great luck D thought, and replied "Yes thank you that would be great! I'm going the same direction". So the two men walked the next 5 blocks, staying dry under the umbrella, until they reached a corner where the stranger had to go into a building. D thanked the stranger, who replied he was sorry that D would get wet for the remainder of his walk to work.

As luck would have it, another stranger standing right next to them overheard the conversation, and invited D to walk under his umbrella for the next few blocks, which would be enough for D to reach his workplace. So D moved under the new stranger's umbrella, not getting a drop wet, and both men continued walking. When they arrived at D's workplace, having noticed that D had not yet expressed any thanks, the new stranger asked, "Sir, I hope you appreciate that you were able to continue walking under my umbrella, so that you never got wet."

To which D replied, "Listen buddy, I was fine before you came along. All you did was continue what the first guy did, so I don't owe you anything."

The second stranger shook his head, turned around and walked away, muttering 'What a $#@%$#!'.

[Don B]

[QUOTE=BlackShirt;434674]

Esten, Obama, etal are either stupid or evil. Obama is certainly evil and since you think Esten is not stupid, well...

I disagree with Paul Ryan on a lot of issues. For example, during the Republican convention he said; "President Obama is not a bad man, he is a bad President".

Don B[/QUOTE

Ok, so Obama is evil. I did not know that you knew him that well. Today, I read that your buddy, Tavis Smiley was smacking him. But what I am interested is, compared to Dick Cheney, who is more evil. I already know who you will pick, but just give me a couple of reasons why.

It has been said that "ideology can be a manifestation of personality disorders". If you are puzzled by that, it just means that often, ideology, religion, patriotism, etc. can locked an individual's mindset where they pre-determined an issue or a person. We can say that our esteemed colleague, Toyman, would be a prime example of that trait.

One reason why I think Obama is evil>
"Indeed, the scary part is that Detroit is what Obama
wants to fundamentally transform America into: a place
where wealth is redistributed, not created, and where
government picks winners and losers in an economy in
which we all ultimately lose."

A quote from:
http://news.investors.com/print/ibd-editorials/071913-664483-detroit-bankruptcy-caused-by-unions-government.aspx

How about citing your quote and I never heard of Tavis Smiley. Cheney has nothing to do with my opinion of Obama.
Don B

[Member #4112]

Esten, you critical reasoning when assigning "blame / credit" is so convoluted it boggles the mind. No twist or turn of logic or outright lie is too much so long as you end at a predetermined point.

In your view Obama can do no wrong regardless of scandals, unemployment, out of control spending and back tracking on his signature legislation to avoid the slaughter that will be 2014.

You are entitled to your opinion but I believe you are seeing not many are agreeing.

[Rev BS]

So should society treat the personality disorders to correct the person's ideology? That's been tried, with a good deal of success, in China, Cambodia and the USSR.

Your know the jihadists dosn't need much to get stirred up. Just mentioned America, and the froth & hate starts to flow. So it is with the name Obama, it unleashes name-calling like Evil and Satan. Notice the similarities.

[Esten]

Tiny, I simply say look at the tax legislation, and assign credit / blame based on who passed the legislation.

Obama is responsible for the taxes in the Affordable Care Act (BTW, kudos for using the correct name). Obama is also responsible for the tax provisions in the Tax Relief, Unemployment Insurance Reauthorization, and Job Creation Act of 2010.

Bush is responsible for the Bush Tax Cuts. They were temporary and expired. BTW, I inferred the tax hike you referred to had to be the expiration of the Bush Tax Cuts, because the legislation I claim saved Doppel money was the legislation extending these cuts (plus the payroll tax legislation).

Obama never passed legislation to raise income taxes on $400K+ incomes. Those rates rose due to the sunset provision in Bush's legislation, but you want to pin the blame on Obama?

BTW, I think Obama gave too much away with the $400K threshold. He should have stuck to his original $200K point, or even gone down to $100K, or let them all expire. I understand why he didn't do the latter though, because it would have been coincident with the payroll tax holiday expiration, a double whammy. He should have found a way to stagger them. I'm glad he achieved a net shift in the tax burden to the wealthy, but we still have a lot to do to reduce the deficit.

[Tiny12]

It has been said that "ideology can be a manifestation of personality disorders". If you are puzzled by that, it just means that often, ideology, religion, patriotism, etc. can locked an individual's mindset where they pre-determined an issue or a person. We can say that our esteemed colleague, Toyman, would be a prime example of that trait.

So should society treat the personality disorders to correct the person's ideology? That's been tried, with a good deal of success, in China, Cambodia and the USSR.

[Rev BS]

[QUOTE=DonB;434667]Esten, Obama, etal are either stupid or evil. Obama is certainly evil and since you think Esten is not stupid, well...

I disagree with Paul Ryan on a lot of issues. For example, during the Republican convention he said; "President Obama is not a bad man, he is a bad President".

Don B[/QUOTE

Ok, so Obama is evil. I did not know that you knew him that well. Today, I read that your buddy, Tavis Smiley was smacking him. But what I am interested is, compared to Dick Cheney, who is more evil. I already know who you will pick, but just give me a couple of reasons why.

It has been said that "ideology can be a manifestation of personality disorders". If you are puzzled by that, it just means that often, ideology, religion, patriotism, etc. can locked an individual's mindset where they pre-determined an issue or a person. We can say that our esteemed colleague, Toyman, would be a prime example of that trait.

[Tiny12]

Okay, I understand. Bush is responsible for the additional tax on income from the Affordable Care Act. Or maybe you'd argue that's not an income tax, it's something else. That would be a real stretch BTW, like something out of Orwell's 1984.

Forgetting about the Affordable Care Act, I assume you'd agree that Obama and Democrats passed a bill that resulted in maintenance of the status quo for certain taxpayers while allowing rates to increase for high earners. And Republicans pushed hard to continue 2012 rates for all taxpayers. And thus saying Obama et al are responsible for the tax hike on high earners is a lie? Again, it's Bush's fault?

Your reasoning is similar to that of Congressmen, both Democrats and Republicans, who consider a 4% or 5% increase in spending to be a "cut." It makes no sense.

[Esten]

I owe Obama nothing as he has done nothing except raise taxes.

Obama has both raised and lowered taxes. You can keep repeating your lies over and over, but that doesn't make them true.

[Esten]

Esten is not stupid, he knows exactly what he's doing. His obfuscations are in the same league as master politicians, like Bill "I-did-not-have-sexual-relations-with-that-woman" Clinton. Obama is largely responsible for a big tax hike on high-earners and successful small businesses that went into effect January 1, 2013.

Tiny you need to look in the mirror.

Obama is not responsible for the recent tax hike for incomes above $400K (or, only responsible in the sense he did not act to stop it). That is a Bush tax increase. The Bush Tax Cuts were temporary, when they went into effect they were a tax cut, and when they expired they were a tax increase. The legislation responsible for that increase was signed by Bush. If you're affected by this increase, blame Bush. It's the same as with Obama's temporary payroll tax cuts. A cut when they went into effect, and an increase when they expired. Your claim that Obama is largely responsible for the tax hike on $400K+ earners is an obfuscation, if not an outright lie.

[Don B]

Esten is not stupid, he knows exactly what he's doing. His obfuscations are in the same league as master politicians, like Bill "I-did-not-have-sexual-relations-with-that-woman" Clinton. Obama is largely responsible for a big tax hike on high-earners and successful small businesses that went into effect January 1, 2013. But because he didn't prevent legislation that delayed the hike for 2 years he saved Doppelganger lots of money, according to Esten.

Adjust income in Texas for purchasing power and taxes and the state starts to look better than California.

And about "race-to-the-bottom capitalism," it's actually race to the top. Look at Hong Kong and Singapore. Look at European countries that have dropped marginal tax rates on businesses far below our level -- they've learned while we're going the other way.

Esten, Obama, etal are either stupid or evil. Obama is certainly evil and since you think Esten is not stupid, well...

I disagree with Paul Ryan on a lot of issues. For example, during the Republican convention he said; "President Obama is not a bad man, he is a bad President".

Don B

[Tiny12]

No need to kneel or call anyone MASTER, Doppel. Simply to give credit where credit is due. Obama helped you save approximately $19,400 in taxes over 2011-12. In other words, you would have paid this much more in taxes without the legislation he signed.

BTW, you were crowing about how well Texas is doing. Texas ranks #18 in unemployment (6.5%, better than national average), but #46 in poverty (16.2%, worse than national average). Texas has the dubious distinction of having the second-highest percentage of minimum wage jobs. Race-to-the-bottom capitalism doesn't lead to prosperity.

Esten is not stupid, he knows exactly what he's doing. His obfuscations are in the same league as master politicians, like Bill "I-did-not-have-sexual-relations-with-that-woman" Clinton. Obama is largely responsible for a big tax hike on high-earners and successful small businesses that went into effect January 1, 2013. But because he didn't prevent legislation that delayed the hike for 2 years he saved Doppelganger lots of money, according to Esten.

Adjust income in Texas for purchasing power and taxes and the state starts to look better than California.

And about "race-to-the-bottom capitalism," it's actually race to the top. Look at Hong Kong and Singapore. Look at European countries that have dropped marginal tax rates on businesses far below our level -- they've learned while we're going the other way.

[Member #4112]

Esten you are so full of it.

I owe Obama nothing as he has done nothing except raise taxes. I suppose the increase of the FICA taxable limit in 2011, again in 2012 and now to $113,700 in 2013 is not a tax increase?

You simply don't understand taxes or choose not to understand to maintain your personal dogma.

Rave on Esten, few are listening and fewer still believe you.

As for Texas, while I doubt your stats, at least we are attracting industry and creating jobs. What is you answer to the 11 million without jobs, to Chicago, Detroit, and the other collapsing liberal bastions drowning in debt?

Your idea of racing to prosperity is the Nanny State? The only equality there is everyone is equally poor and dependent upon the government.

[Esten]

Esten, if harping on Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare are socialists programs and trying to convince people they need to kneel down to the new MASTER in the White House for his endless bounty, his most transparent administration in history, his 17 Trillion debt, and scandals galore you've got a real problem.

No need to kneel or call anyone MASTER, Doppel. Simply to give credit where credit is due. Obama helped you save approximately $19,400 in taxes over 2011-12. In other words, you would have paid this much more in taxes without the legislation he signed.

Here's some more numbers for you, the latest Gallup approval numbers. Why do you think Republican approval numbers are in the toilet?
Obama: 48%
Congressional Democrats: 34%
Congressional Republicans: 26%

BTW, you were crowing about how well Texas is doing. Texas ranks #18 in unemployment (6.5%, better than national average), but #46 in poverty (16.2%, worse than national average). Texas has the dubious distinction of having the second-highest percentage of minimum wage jobs. Race-to-the-bottom capitalism doesn't lead to prosperity.

[Member #4112]

Esten, if harping on Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare are socialists programs and trying to convince people they need to kneel down to the new MASTER in the White House for his endless bounty, his most transparent administration in history, his 17 Trillion debt, and scandals galore you've got a real problem.

No need to visit foreign policy.