For Early-Retired Expats

[Alan23]

Might as well import a latina to the states considering the amount of youth it would take me to earn that amount of money.

Tigre,

Your last comment indicates you haven't mastered the concepts here:

1. Importing a chica - even if possible, would defeat the purpose since she would immediately become the dreaded "Americanized female" that I presume you are trying to avoid.

2. Marry her and watch 50% of your assets VAPORIZE (and kiss the possibility of living aboard good-bye)

Good luck and save, save, save.

[Tigre]

Tigre,

You've got make the "Big Score", dummy, Hard work and honesty will get you no where. You've got to cheat or scam someone out of a bundle. Then you can retire to Buenos Aires too fuck whores and piss the rest of your life away.

Fuck being productive, working hard and saving most of your life, not to mention your own self respect. Why denie yourself anything, why not have it all now. That way you can look back at your life and say to yourself I did absolutely nothing all my life but fuck varrious whores in South America.

I'd suggest a big "Drug Deal", a milliom dollars or more, all you need is one and theres no tax's remember. After you pissed that money away, and you will, because you have no "Self Respect" or "Common Sence", well then do another one.

Just remember it doesn't take any brains to spend money, any dumb MotherFucker can do that. It takes real Brains to make the "Big Score" then piss it all away on cheap whores.

Exon

Tu eres el Diablo.

[El Perro]

Tigre,

Your thought about working in the states 6 months and spending the rest of the year here is a good one. It will give you time to determine if you really want to be here permanently. All these questions you have will only really be answered by being here. Otherwise you are just jacking off and using up Jackson's bandwidth. Come on down or put a sock in it.

Cheers.

[Exon123]

Tigre,

You've got make the "Big Score", dummy, Hard work and honesty will get you no where. You've got to cheat or scam someone out of a bundle. Then you can retire to Buenos Aires too fuck whores and piss the rest of your life away.

Fuck being productive, working hard and saving most of your life, not to mention your own self respect. Why denie yourself anything, why not have it all now. That way you can look back at your life and say to yourself I did absolutely nothing all my life but fuck varrious whores in South America.

I'd suggest a big "Drug Deal", a milliom dollars or more, all you need is one and theres no tax's remember. After you pissed that money away, and you will, because you have no "Self Respect" or "Common Sence", well then do another one.

Just remember it doesn't take any brains to spend money, any dumb MotherFucker can do that. It takes real Brains to make the "Big Score" then piss it all away on cheap whores.

Exon

[Tigre]

So how did all you guys do it? Are you all millionaires? Didn't have any children so you can afford this lifestyle? Hit the lottery? What?

$600k, eh? Might as well import a latina to the states considering the amount of youth it would take me to earn that amount of money.

[Moore]

I figure you could retire in BsAs with US$600k. US$100k to buy your place and the remaining $500k should give you $2,300/month forever after taxes and inflation. That's not a bad rent-free income there even before the 2001-2002 devaluation.

Long term U.S. equity returns are about 10.5% over the last 100 years or so. Taking out taxes of 15% and inflation of 3.5% you're still over 5% net withdrawal rate, allowing funds to grow with inflation. We're talking about retiring young so with 40+ years of retired life ahead it seems probable that you will realize the long term market return rate over such a period.

Owning your own place in Argentina is key factor. Rent rates as percentage of purchase prices are still very low but that probably won't last forever. To be secure you should lock in at a fixed housing cost and since conventional mortgages aren't available the only option is to buy outright. Renting long term would be too much exposure to inflation.

One important financial benefit you should take into account is medical cost, which is astronomically high in USA but quite cheap in Argentina. As you get older this is an enormous expense (the largest in some cases) factored into the U.S. retirement budget equation, whereas in Argentina your full medical cost will run a fixed monthly amount roughly equivalent to your telephone/internet bill.

[Tigre]

It won't last 30 yrs? Hmm.

Anyway, you have some valid points. Many men derive their self-image from what they do. Yes, most of the Expats are in their 50s and beyond. That's fine.

I suppose I shouldnt count of my ability to make friends with tourists. How bout the locals? Wouldnt they be my friends?

And the chicas? Filling my day with good deeds shouldnt be a problem. I can think of rising in the morning to go to a restaurant, healthy exercise, sex romps, reading, movies, day trips to various regions of the country, and laughing at American feminists.

[Thomaso276]

Ty: you need to speak with a financial planner regarding your investment goals and monetary needs for any retirement, early or not. Remember it is not what you make but what you spend.

Consider as well the concept of retiring at 36. Retirement means no more work. Period. (playing the stocks an hour a day is not work)

Who will you socialize with? All of your peers will be working, raising familes etc. You will end up hanging out with a bunch of older guys who may not accept you as a peer and with whom you may not have any shared interests. Not everyone can do that, I would venture to say the majority of people enjoy their careers and need some self fulfillment (see hierarchy of needs) during the course of their lives that goes beyond money. There are exceptions - the blue blooded, silver spoon types who had things handed to them at every turn. Not working their whole life or having some fronted political job where they play golf daily with clients is normal. Or a guy I know who hit the lottery with his business and sold it for millions. He travels the world staying in places for about a year at a time. I knew a guy who ran car stereo stores. He would open up in a city and run the hell out of it for 5 years, sell it, travel the world for a year, go back to the States and start over. It was pretty interesting. If you can develop a business model that will give you millions by 36 then not working makes sense. But I'll bet you that after a couple of years you will be bored and miss the action of making something happen. Chances are you will get into a business and then you are not retired.

I am not saying everyone likes work or that you fall into any category as I know nothing about you; but most guys I have met down here worked 25-30 years (not counting their teens washing dishes or caddying during the summer for some coin) and had a full career accomplishing goals (some extraordinary and talented people are hanging around this forum) and when the time came for retirement they were mentally and financially ready. Early retirement starts in the 50's for the majority of Americans.

The economy in Argentina is so historically unstable no one can truly tell what will be going on here in the next few years. There are no minor swings based on their history. By the time you are ready this place may be the next Iraq. Middle class here is currently about 2-3 thousand US monthly but has gone up every year since the crash. Your retirement income is usually in stable conservative investments and between inflation and possible investment problems, 1/4 of a million will not last 30 years.

I retired at 50 - my last career was 20 years, I had 10 year experiences in other work fields and started working sumers when I was 13. I had enuff work to last me a lifetime so retirement for me was comfortable. Some freinds of mine can retire anytime they want as they are financially secure but they still enjoy the work ethic that got them to where they are today and it keeps them going (with a little help from the chicas every couple of months!

Good luck in your future endeavors.

[Jaimito Cartero]

I'd suggest a "Big Score" such as a major "Drug Deal" or robbing a Bank for a lot of money. Then "Live the Life" spending as much as you want on anything you want, pussy, fancy cars, housing, ect, ect.

Then after you run out of money, "Do it Again" and "Again" until you get caught. Then lie and say you really didn't mean to do it, its just than your a lazy Monger and don't want to work, all you really want to do in life is "Fuck Off" and be iresponciable.

Well, it's worked out well for you, right?

[Tigre]

I'd suggest a "Big Score" such as a major "Drug Deal" or robbing a Bank for a lot of money. Then "Live the Life" spending as much as you want on anything you want, pussy, fancy cars, housing, ect, ect.

Then after you run out of money, "Do it Again" and "Again" until you get caught. Then lie and say you really didn't mean to do it, its just than your a lazy Monger and don't want to work, all you really want to do in life is "Fuck Off" and be iresponciable.

Exon.

Exon

[health career] can make 65K per year. That's not alot to some guys, but that's above the median. Being frugal, a guy can retire before he's 40, as long as the dollar doesnt plummet too fast. I was figuring 250K in savings should do it. Nay? And if not, working 6 months on US and 6 months off in Latin America might be a better option.

Please, I am not Saint! Bragging about making a million dollars. So take it easy on me. No fabrications here.

[Exon123]

For those of you who had an actual plan to work hard while young to retire early and expat:

How much money per year does it cost to have a modest lifestyle there with some sacrifices?

How much per year should I try to save in order to retire early and live 30 years or so on interest?

Are any of you able to work a few days a wk down there to offset dipping too deeply into your savings?

What currency do you keep your accounts in?

Anyone who wishes to remain anonymous can PM me.

Thanks, fellas.

I do have lots more questions though.

I'm currently 29 why / o. I'd like to be in S. A. Full-time by the time I'm 36.

I'd suggest a "Big Score" such as a major "Drug Deal" or robbing a Bank for a lot of money. Then "Live the Life" spending as much as you want on anything you want, pussy, fancy cars, housing, ect, ect.

Then after you run out of money, "Do it Again" and "Again" until you get caught. Then lie and say you really didn't mean to do it, its just than your a lazy Monger and don't want to work, all you really want to do in life is "Fuck Off" and be iresponciable.

Exon.

Exon

[Hunt99]

The younger one is, the less they can afford to take. A 90 year old is going to be fine on an 8% withdrawal rate. A young retiree of 50 ought to be at about 3% , and should emphasize growth (i.e. a diversified basket of stocks) in his portfolio, with only a few years' worth of withdrawals held in cash, laddered CDs, REITs, and bonds. Every 7 or 8 years he can rebalance, liquidate some of the stock money to pay for another period of expenses in cash, especially if there has been appreciation, and start the process all over again. He'll also want to get more conservative with time, but even a 70 year old in normal health needs a growth component to his nest egg.

SL - if you price out that 275K condo over, let's say, 20 years, your monthly cost of living down there is indeed running you around 3K a month, which is what I suggested a guy would need. Probably more, since that 275K isn't doing a whole lot for you except for the hope of price appreciation. If I had been in your shoes, I think I would have rather kept that 275K in my portfolio and rented a comparable place for 1500 bucks a month or so. But that's a judgment call you had to make, so there's no one right answer.

[Darkstar]

I forget the source of my figure, but I understood that organizations that run on an endowment typically use it as a reference figure. Of course, the difference between 4 and 5% is significant - a 25% pay raise! I guess I wouldn't stake my life or reputation on the 5% number. This advice is worth what you paid for it! There's quite a lot of discussion on the 'safe withdrawal rate' question on the Retire Early page. Looking at their stuff, 5% looks downright reckless!

[AllIWantIsLove]

I have some retirement planning comments:

- A conservative rule of thumb is that you can take 5% of your invested savings forever without reducing the principal.

<SNIP>

-Doug

I haven't kept a record of all the figures I've seen, but I don't think that 5% is conservative. 2% is the lowest figure I've seen. That was from a well known financial writer, but I forget her name now. I don't recall ever seeing a figure above 4%. I'd loved to be convinced that 5% is OK.

Bob

[BadMan]

I would say you can get a nice 1000 sq ft place for about 150K in BA, The going rate for property is around 1500 US a sq meter and up, Recoleta is about 2000 a sq meter. Palermo is around 1500-2000. Las Canitas is going way up and the sq meter in a new Las Canitas tower is about $2500 US.

You can get a nice brand new 80-100 sq meter apartment in Barrio Norte / Palermo for about 150-160 fully furnished if you are willing to do it all yourself. Cars in BA cost more than in the US, but the prices are becoming more and more comparable as the years go by, so pretty soon I would think that prices will also be pretty similair.

The cost of home ownership in BA is about 200-300 US a month, and that would include building expenses (generally 100-200 US) your bills shouldnt be more than another 100-150 US (that would include Direct TV, High speed internet and gas and electricity, which is incredibly cheap in AR) So in total you would spend around 300 US a month on property expenses.

On car expenses, you would need about 100-200 US for insurance, depending on the value of your car. 100 to pay for a fixed parking space in a 24 hour guarded parking lot and about 100 pesos on gas a week, so about another 300-400 a month there.

As for living expenses, another 1000 would be more than enough, though if you really want to live like a king, 2000 would be more than enough. So you can live very well in BA with an initial property investment of anywhere from 150-200K and a vehicle investment of 30-50K, you should spend around 600-800 maintaining and insuring those investments and another 1000-2000 living the good life.

So $1,800-$2,800 should be more than enough to live well here. But rent is on a steady increase and so are property values. And the cost of living is slowly edging up as well.

Don't keep money in Pesos, keep 50% of your money in a European bank in Euros, 40 % of your money in Dollars in the US, and 10% in an Uruguayan bank in dollars as well. I know there are guys here that are all about the Dollar, I am not, I would say a 50/50 split is the way to go.

Bad