American Politics during the Obama Presidency

[Jackson]

"Democracy in America is doomed when the people learn to vote themselves money from the public trough."

Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America (1835)

[Member #4112]

"The Democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who are not."

Thomas Jefferson.

Jackson, I think Thomas Jefferson got it right over 200 years ago.

Trying to explain this to a liberal is like the old Harley saying, "if I have to explain it to you, you will never understand".

Same thing here.

We are currently spending $200,000,000 more than we take in every hour of every day!

[Jackson]

Health Care & Education should be basic citizen rights.

How noble, except your plan requires a system wherein money is taken at gunpoint from people who earned it for themselves, to be used to buy medical services for strangers who do not wish to pay for their own medical needs.

That's morally repugnant.

Thanks,

Jax

[Rev BS]

That's all bullshit.

First, the American people did not have a health crisis before ObamaCare as 85% of American citizens were covered by a medical plan, including every person under the age of 18 and every person over the age of 65.

Second, many Americans were ready "to explore new avenues" like tort reform and allowing insurers to compete across state lines, but the liberals weren't interested in improving the health care delivery system as their actual goal was to foster more government dependency for their own political aggrandizement.

Thanks,

Jax.

That is what going to a hospital in America is if you do not have insurance. Yeah, it might work for a few people, but it's a rip-off. And health care in America is a rip off. You know it, and everybody's grandmother knows it.

Health Care & Education should be basic citizen rights. Most GOP reform plans do not touch private insurers. Obama did something, workable or not, we will find out. But doing nothing, and trying to defeat it by calling it socialism is just selfish. We already know how Congresss work, they are not for the people. And too many of Americans are like sheep, easily sway by fear and right-wing jihardists.

[WorldTravel69]

Here are some facts.
That you wouldn't find on FOX.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_2918705.html

That's all bullshit.

First, the American people did not have a health crisis before ObamaCare as 85% of American citizens were covered by a medical plan, including every person under the age of 18 and every person over the age of 65.

Second, many Americans were ready "to explore new avenues" like tort reform and allowing insurers to compete across state lines, but the liberals weren't interested in improving the health care delivery system as their actual goal was to foster more government dependency for their own political aggrandizement.

Thanks,

Jax.

[Jackson]

When I came back from different continents and countries, and told people and even show them pictures of wondrous mongering encounters at fast food prices, they would really get excited. Yet when the time came to join me, they had a thousand reasons for staying home and suffering the same old shit.

Now the medical system in America is broken except for the people with good jobs and good benefits. It is a system that caters to the big players who have been screwing the masses like the big financial companies do. Yet when the time came to explore new avenues to solve a very important issue, many Americans will not take the step. Whilst ObamaCare might not be the perfect system, we can surely work our way to that goal once we get the show on the road. Just like mongering, eh!

I was looking at the Civil War Map. Lo & behold, it looks exactly the same as the ObamaCare map. I think Florida has since defected?

That's all bullshit.

First, the American people did not have a health crisis before ObamaCare as 85% of American citizens were covered by a medical plan, including every person under the age of 18 and every person over the age of 65.

Second, many Americans were ready "to explore new avenues" like tort reform and allowing insurers to compete across state lines, but the liberals weren't interested in improving the health care delivery system as their actual goal was to foster more government dependency for their own political aggrandizement.

Thanks,

Jax.

[Rev BS]

When I came back from different continents and countries, and told people and even show them pictures of wondrous mongering encounters at fast food prices, they would really get excited. Yet when the time came to join me, they had a thousand reasons for staying home and suffering the same old shit.

Now the medical system in America is broken except for the people with good jobs and good benefits. It is a system that caters to the big players who have been screwing the masses like the big financial companies do. Yet when the time came to explore new avenues to solve a very important issue, many Americans will not take the step. Whilst ObamaCare might not be the perfect system, we can surely work our way to that goal once we get the show on the road. Just like mongering, eh!

I was looking at the Civil War Map. Lo & behold, it looks exactly the same as the ObamaCare map. I think Florida has since defected?

[Punter 127]

Looks like Harry Reid also agrees with you.

It looks like the Democrats won this one. They always wanted a Single Payer system. Republicans fought to include the private insurers.

"Reid: ObamaCare Just a Step Towards Single-Payer System.

Reid also said that ObamaCare was "a step in the right direction" and that America has to "work our way past" insurance-based health care.

"Single-payer" is a deceptive term that means "socialized medicine." Insurance companies are put out of business and the government takes over as the sole payer of all health care costs."

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...s-single-payer

[Esten]

There's a (structured) profit motive built into the Affordable Care Act to support private insurer participation. But not every insurer is necessarily going to participate in every state. Aetna for example, is not participating in the exchanges in three states. One of them being California where Aetna never planned to participate in the first place.

Is California stuck without Aetna? Not at all, there are 12 private insurers with plans that meet ACA standards (Ref. www.coveredca.com):

Alameda Alliance for Health
Anthem Blue Cross of California
Blue Shield of California
Chinese Community Health Plan
Contra Costa Health Plan
Health Net
Kaiser Permanente
L.A. Care Health Plan
Molina Healthcare
Sharp Health Plan
Valley Health Plan
Western Health Advantage

The entire US healthcare system has been and continues to prepare for ACA. The myopic propaganda from Republicans and right-wing media (Faux News, Investors Business Daily, Breitbart, etc) is a tiny sliver of what's going on -- and not to be trusted or taken as representative.

[Punter 127]

It looks like the Democrats won this one. They always wanted a Single Payer system. Republicans fought to include the private insurers.

Sadly I agree, it appears ObamaCare was designed to fail in order to get a Single Payer system, and complete government control of the health care system.

Unfortunately the American people will be the losers, not the Republicans.

[Big Boss Man]

Major Health Insurers Abandon ObamaCare Exchanges

"Anthem Blue Cross, Aetna, United Health Group, and Humana have all decided against participating in various states' ObamaCare health insurance exchanges. The exchanges, which are scheduled to begin operation on October 1st, will be the only place Americans can purchase health insurance using federal subsidies granted by President Obama's signature healthcare reform law."

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...Care-Exchanges

I hear the train a comin'.

It looks like the Democrats won this one. They always wanted a Single Payer system. Republicans fought to include the private insurers.

[Punter 127]

Major Health Insurers Abandon ObamaCare Exchanges

"Anthem Blue Cross, Aetna, United Health Group, and Humana have all decided against participating in various states' ObamaCare health insurance exchanges. The exchanges, which are scheduled to begin operation on October 1st, will be the only place Americans can purchase health insurance using federal subsidies granted by President Obama's signature healthcare reform law."

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...Care-Exchanges

I hear the train a comin'.

[TejanoLibre]

But, not at the Gun Shows.

Bill Mayer is a comedian so he makes fun of the dumb politicians.

Private Sales are Exempt but.

Licensed dealers are required to perform a background check for ALL gun sales including gun shows but Joe Blow can rent a table at a gun show and sell 1000 guns to ANYBODY without even asking their name.

I did it for years in Texas. This is one of the things that they want to change.

TL.

This is my rifle and this is my gun! This one's for fighting and this one's for fun!

[WorldTravel69]

But, not at the Gun Shows.

Bill Mayer is a comedian so he makes fun of the dumb politicians.

WT, Esten is making that argument not me.

By the way we have a background check system in place just in case you did not notice.

[Esten]

The recent posts and arguments from conservatives here are among the weakest and delusional I've seen in a long time. What's up guys? I don't know whether to feel sad or laugh.

- Word substitutions to flip arguments around (how unoriginal).
- Claims that all healthcare is now delivered through the tertiary level (large hospitals). I guess those physician clinics I drive by are all imaginary.
- Comparing low-cost healthcare plans with ACA-level coverage, to low-cost plans with flimsy coverage (apples to oranges).
- Considering the idea of people determining the role of their government to be "disgusting" and nazi-esque.
- Claims that high healthcare costs are driven by lazy government bureaucrats.
- Calls for personal responsibility and paying for your own health insurance, while ignoring the fact the ACA has an individual mandate, a concept that has a long history of Republican support for these very reasons.

Man, you guys are a mess.